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How To Hire Outsourced Developers

donnfelker.com

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Re: How To Hire Outsourced Developers

#31

Post by mahyarm »

SheepSlapper wrote: post #9

Is anyone else tired of being assigned homework when applying for jobs? In both this and the author's previous article on hiring, he mentions giving people tasks to complete by a certain deadline as part of the hiring process. For someone that's just starting out as a programmer then maybe that's reasonable, but for those of us that've been in software for years, what's the point? You wouldn't ask a carpenter to make…

Can a developer on a H1-B/TN/etc visa in the US legally do these homework assignments?

Re: How To Hire Outsourced Developers

#32

Post by donnfelker »

mahyarm wrote: post #31
SheepSlapper wrote: post #9

Is anyone else tired of being assigned homework when applying for jobs? In both this and the author's previous article on hiring, he mentions giving people tasks to complete by a certain deadline as part of the hiring process. For someone that's just starting out as a programmer then maybe that's reasonable, but for those of us that've been in software for years, what's the point? You wouldn't ask a carpenter to make…

Can a developer on a H1-B/TN/etc visa in the US legally do these homework assignments?

Yes. I'd hire anyone who willing to work and has the skills. To me, great talent is everywhere. You just have to find it. I have just happened to find great talent over seas. I HAVE hired nearshore (USA) and had success and failures too.

Re: How To Hire Outsourced Developers

#33

Post by mathattack »

SheepSlapper wrote: post #9

Is anyone else tired of being assigned homework when applying for jobs? In both this and the author's previous article on hiring, he mentions giving people tasks to complete by a certain deadline as part of the hiring process. For someone that's just starting out as a programmer then maybe that's reasonable, but for those of us that've been in software for years, what's the point? You wouldn't ask a carpenter to make…

A paid hour is a reasonable amount of homework if someone is actively looking for a job. You can't pull someone from a firm that isn't looking, but for contract work, it's reasonable. If I'm actively applying for a job that I am very interested in, I want them to do a lot of things that scare away other candidates and will allow me to shine. I've happily done 4 hours of unpaid homework. An hour is perfectly normal.

Re: How To Hire Outsourced Developers

#35

Post by semerda »

Nice insights. Thank you for sharing.

This is simple. If you are hiring an engineer you should be one too. This way you can hire faster and fire faster. No bullshit.

Outsourcing work overseas is 5x cheaper than local try-and-see-how-it-goes. Not a long term solution but a short term one to get stuff done. Hire fast, fire fast. So if you make a mistake move fast to get another one on the job. You wont bleed as much money from a mistake of outsourcing to the wrong candidate.

I have been through this a number of times over the years and documented my learnings on outsourcing pros & cons here: http://www.theroadtosiliconvalley.com/technology/outsourcing...

Re: How To Hire Outsourced Developers

#36

Post by codegeek »

mahyarm wrote: post #31
SheepSlapper wrote: post #9

Is anyone else tired of being assigned homework when applying for jobs? In both this and the author's previous article on hiring, he mentions giving people tasks to complete by a certain deadline as part of the hiring process. For someone that's just starting out as a programmer then maybe that's reasonable, but for those of us that've been in software for years, what's the point? You wouldn't ask a carpenter to make…

Can a developer on a H1-B/TN/etc visa in the US legally do these homework assignments?

IANAL but my understanding is that on H1B, you can only work for your current employer. So, you cannot do these assignments legally and you definitely cannot accept money. But it is possible to have multiple H1Bs to work part time for multiple employers even though that is a totally different story.

Re: How To Hire Outsourced Developers

#37

Post by TulliusCicero »

mathattack wrote: post #33
SheepSlapper wrote: post #9

Is anyone else tired of being assigned homework when applying for jobs? In both this and the author's previous article on hiring, he mentions giving people tasks to complete by a certain deadline as part of the hiring process. For someone that's just starting out as a programmer then maybe that's reasonable, but for those of us that've been in software for years, what's the point? You wouldn't ask a carpenter to make…

A paid hour is a reasonable amount of homework if someone is actively looking for a job. You can't pull someone from a firm that isn't looking, but for contract work, it's reasonable. If I'm actively applying for a job that I am very interested in, I want them to do a lot of things that scare away other candidates and will allow me to shine. I've happily done 4 hours of unpaid homework. An hour is perfectly normal.

Exactly. Getting hired for a normal salaried job can easily involve an hour or two in phone screens, and then basically a whole workday in on-site interviews. An hour for a contract position seems completely reasonable.

Re: How To Hire Outsourced Developers

#38

Post by TulliusCicero »

dkuntz2 wrote: post #14
SheepSlapper wrote: post #9

Is anyone else tired of being assigned homework when applying for jobs? In both this and the author's previous article on hiring, he mentions giving people tasks to complete by a certain deadline as part of the hiring process. For someone that's just starting out as a programmer then maybe that's reasonable, but for those of us that've been in software for years, what's the point? You wouldn't ask a carpenter to make…

Right, you would look at similar things that your potential carpenter has built. You would also try to do that with programmers. But a good deal of the things programmers built are team built, or proprietary, it's difficult to know what they've created in the past. Having them work on a simple task beforehand is a way to normalize and make sure every programmer you're looking at is on a level field.

Also, unlike a programmer, a carpenter can't simply copy+paste work that someone else did and claim it as his own. It's a lot harder to fake tangible work in real life than it is to fake intangible work on the internet.

Re: How To Hire Outsourced Developers

#39

Post by gedrap »

bcbrown wrote: post #21
SheepSlapper wrote: post #9

Is anyone else tired of being assigned homework when applying for jobs? In both this and the author's previous article on hiring, he mentions giving people tasks to complete by a certain deadline as part of the hiring process. For someone that's just starting out as a programmer then maybe that's reasonable, but for those of us that've been in software for years, what's the point? You wouldn't ask a carpenter to make…

> when you could easily look at all the work I've already done? While I agree with you that homework-style pre-screenings aren't something I like, I think for a lot of people it's hard for prospective employers to look at previous work, since it may be proprietary. Also, this is for a contractor role, and he says he pays their full rate for this homework assignment.

This. After the first 1.5 year I had nothing to show because the products either didn't launch, or were software for companies internal usage. So I would have been happy to do that. And since it's paid at the full rate, what's the problem?
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