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N.S.A. Devises Radio Pathway Into Computers

nytimes.com

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Re: N.S.A. Devises Radio Pathway Into Computers

#121

Post by fit2rule »

bananacurve wrote: post #120
fit2rule wrote: post #118

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think that your idolatry of the NSA is unwarranted. They have powers and technologies that they can use to actively thwart anyone who will cross an American interest. They're not a military organization; the military is simply one of their biggest customers. What they are, is a totalitarian control mechanism for American political and business interests to apply around the world. So if you are on the 'American' sid…

The entire West is complicit. Pretending it is just America ensures the status quo remains in place. Also look up the word tyranny, it doesn't mean whatever you want it to.

You look up the word tyranny - it absolutely applies to the NSA situation!

And just saying 'others do it too' isn't enough to weasle out of the fact that the USA spends far, far, far more energy and effort on establishing its tyranny - militarily and technologically - than any other country.

Fact is, 'others' would like to live in a world where we don't have to deal with secret injections at the whim of a politician in our lives. Some of us would like to build companies to compete with the American hegemony, and some of us would very much like to reduce the power that the military-industrial tyrants currently ruling America have over the worlds' population. We're not happy having to deal with American pixy-dust solutions to the problem that they're not in control ..

Re: N.S.A. Devises Radio Pathway Into Computers

#122

Post by bananacurve »

fit2rule wrote: post #121
bananacurve wrote: post #120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The entire West is complicit. Pretending it is just America ensures the status quo remains in place. Also look up the word tyranny, it doesn't mean whatever you want it to.

You look up the word tyranny - it absolutely applies to the NSA situation! And just saying 'others do it too' isn't enough to weasle out of the fact that the USA spends far, far, far more energy and effort on establishing its tyranny - militarily and technologically - than any other country. Fact is, 'others' would like to live in a world where we don't have to deal with secret injections at the whim of a politician…

It's not "others do it too" it is that the entire West has a shared security model and Europe has outsourced much of its defense.

http://cphpost.dk/news/denmark-is-one-of-the-nsas-9-eyes.761...

>Some of us would like to build companies to compete with the American hegemony

And you think the NSA is stopping you, well I don't know what to say to that.

Re: N.S.A. Devises Radio Pathway Into Computers

#123

Post by tomelders »

todayiamme wrote: post #5

I do understand that it is now the status quo to disavow everything the NSA is, but foreign intelligence gathering is their mission and releasing these details simply doesn't help the cause of fixing the NSA's less savoury incursions. While arguably any foreign intelligence agency of note isn't going to be caught off guard by these leaks, leaking these details does offer political ammunition to the very people who st…

It's now reasonable to assume that any resources the NSA have are being used on innocent people form around the world with no connection (supposed or otherwise) with terrorism.

So I think it is valid for victims to be made aware of the tools their enemies in the security services are using against them.

Re: N.S.A. Devises Radio Pathway Into Computers

#124

Post by unclebucknasty »

eru wrote: post #78
unclebucknasty wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Interestingly, this would also seem to have the potential to defeat encryption, since it directly accesses working memory. This is why I have always been cautious about those who advocate personal cryptography as a privacy solution. We need clear laws, first and foremost, to reign them in. Otherwise, we are effectively saying that if they can get it (i.e. decrypt it), it is fair game. Cat-and-mouse is not a game we w…

Laws are not going to protect people from the NSA. Especially laws that only apply to a miniscule fraction of the population (ie the fraction of the population that lives in the USA). Spy agencies are a global menace.

Of course laws will protect us. They are actually our only real hope. With the right laws, Snowden is a whistleblower with due protection. There is no debate as to whether he is a "traitor" or who broke the law, and the entire dynamic is changed here.

Either we are a nation of laws or we are not. Laws are what constrain our government and what confer and protect all of our rights. Why should this be any different? Why should we suddenly abandon law here in favor of some (inevitably inadequate) technical scheme? It is naive to believe otherwise and it is more naive (catastrophic) to advocate a model wherein we do not rely on laws, but instead our personal capabilities to protect our rights from our own government. Advocating encryption over laws is just one example of that.

Protecting ourselves from the government with tech is a tempting, freedom-figthting technologist's fantasy. We cannot even duly protect ourselves from zero-day exploits. Why on earth would we abandon the law and position ourselves to play cat-and-mouse with the U.S. government?

Re: N.S.A. Devises Radio Pathway Into Computers

#125

Post by fit2rule »

bananacurve wrote: post #122
fit2rule wrote: post #121

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You look up the word tyranny - it absolutely applies to the NSA situation! And just saying 'others do it too' isn't enough to weasle out of the fact that the USA spends far, far, far more energy and effort on establishing its tyranny - militarily and technologically - than any other country. Fact is, 'others' would like to live in a world where we don't have to deal with secret injections at the whim of a politician…

It's not "others do it too" it is that the entire West has a shared security model and Europe has outsourced much of its defense. http://cphpost.dk/news/denmark-is-one-of-the-nsas-9-eyes.761... >Some of us would like to build companies to compete with the American hegemony And you think the NSA is stopping you, well I don't know what to say to that.

"Entire West"? You're showing your prejudice. Not everyone in the Western world is content to bend over for American tyranny.

And you think the NSA won't interfere, should I start up a company that will compete with the US? They sure will. This is why there is such heat on this subject, duh .. why compete with the American Industrial Spook Empire, if they can inject code into your systems, remotely, without detection. If they can inspect all the packets, wherever. If they decide, after I become successful at something that might impact an American-Industrial Giant's applecart, to use my neighbours router to hide their destruction of my business?

Screw that. I don't want to hear an excuse - I want to hear a solution, from our American friends. Damn right I want a revolution!

Re: N.S.A. Devises Radio Pathway Into Computers

#126

Post by NKCSS »

igravious wrote: post #110
NKCSS wrote: post #108

I remember an article on here a while back of a well known security or cryptology researcher that had a machine get re-infected by unknown malware time and time again without a network connection, who also observed radio waves and thought that was the iv...

Was it this? https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=6646936 "Mysterious Mac and PC malware that jumps airgaps?"

Yup, thanks!

Re: N.S.A. Devises Radio Pathway Into Computers

#127

Post by bananacurve »

fit2rule wrote: post #125
bananacurve wrote: post #122

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not "others do it too" it is that the entire West has a shared security model and Europe has outsourced much of its defense. http://cphpost.dk/news/denmark-is-one-of-the-nsas-9-eyes.761... >Some of us would like to build companies to compete with the American hegemony And you think the NSA is stopping you, well I don't know what to say to that.

"Entire West"? You're showing your prejudice. Not everyone in the Western world is content to bend over for American tyranny. And you think the NSA won't interfere, should I start up a company that will compete with the US? They sure will. This is why there is such heat on this subject, duh .. why compete with the American Industrial Spook Empire, if they can inject code into your systems, remotely, without detection…

Shouldn't you be out on a ledge somewhere?

Re: N.S.A. Devises Radio Pathway Into Computers

#128

Post by igravious »

NKCSS wrote: post #126
igravious wrote: post #110

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Was it this? https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=6646936 "Mysterious Mac and PC malware that jumps airgaps?"

Yup, thanks!

I remember coming to the conclusion at the time that the security researcher must be kind of going nuts or something; doesn't seem quite so nuts now. Surely a professional would spot a rogue chip or device though?

Re: N.S.A. Devises Radio Pathway Into Computers

#129

Post by fit2rule »

bananacurve wrote: post #127
fit2rule wrote: post #125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Entire West"? You're showing your prejudice. Not everyone in the Western world is content to bend over for American tyranny. And you think the NSA won't interfere, should I start up a company that will compete with the US? They sure will. This is why there is such heat on this subject, duh .. why compete with the American Industrial Spook Empire, if they can inject code into your systems, remotely, without detection…

Shouldn't you be out on a ledge somewhere?

Shouldn't you be building bombs to prop up your economy?

Re: N.S.A. Devises Radio Pathway Into Computers

#130

Post by JetSpiegel »

asveikau wrote: post #97
JetSpiegel wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's why the parent called it political ammuniton. Circular logic is the C of politics.

Not sure I get the analogy. Are you saying you don't understand C? Wouldn't that be your problem, not someone else's?

I meant it's the foundation for most things, only understood by a small number of people. Can be obfuscated.

It was a weak analogy anyway.

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