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N.S.A. Devises Radio Pathway Into Computers

nytimes.com

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Re: N.S.A. Devises Radio Pathway Into Computers

#41

Post by lancewiggs »

IBM wrote: post #36
eru wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What if the foreignerns don't want to spied up on? Or do they count for less?

What is the use of acting naive about foreign affairs, diplomacy, and statecraft? Are you really suggesting that your country's intelligence service doesn't attempt to do the same?

The USA has diplomatic relations with foreign countries based on trust. They also trade with those foreign countries - and that international trade is what makes the economy and our lifestyles work.

Targeting "all foreigners" destroys trust that foreigners have in the USA system for trade and diplomacy, lowering the impact of the state on both.

Re: N.S.A. Devises Radio Pathway Into Computers

#42

Post by _bfhp »

codex wrote: post #37

This is another example of how Snowden has compromised national security by leaking secret information that has nothing to do with American metadata and everything to do with the NSA's charter and legal mission.

Except if we actually put this story into context of how the US government does things, we realize that if this technique of spying isn't already being used on US citizens, it soon will be. Drones, wire-tapping, and infectious state-created spyware came home from the War on Terror, what makes you think this practice won't?

Of course, neither of us can prove anything either way, but context is necessary before making analyses like yours

Re: N.S.A. Devises Radio Pathway Into Computers

#43

Post by rosser »

brodney wrote: post #38
PythonicAlpha wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why do you go into political discussion boards (meaning political news here), when you don't like them? Just wondering.

I came looking for a discussion of the mechanism by which such an attack might be possible.

You can probably tell by the top post in any given sub-thread whether it's going to be technical or political.

You also have a scroll {gesture, wheel, bar}.

I think you can probably take it from there...

Re: N.S.A. Devises Radio Pathway Into Computers

#44

Post by PythonicAlpha »

brodney wrote: post #38
PythonicAlpha wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why do you go into political discussion boards (meaning political news here), when you don't like them? Just wondering.

I came looking for a discussion of the mechanism by which such an attack might be possible.

That's Ok, but you might agree, that since last year, the topic is highly political. I also don't think, that you could simply dissect discussion lines ...

Re: N.S.A. Devises Radio Pathway Into Computers

#45

Post by samstave »

codex wrote: post #37

This is another example of how Snowden has compromised national security by leaking secret information that has nothing to do with American metadata and everything to do with the NSA's charter and legal mission.

Any thought that the NSA is adding to our national security is a delusion.

How about a shift in your thinking: Instead f "securing" ourselves through trillions in weapons and intel BS - why not work toward creating a better world through better systems and people?

How many Norwegian terrorists have there been?

Fuck the NSA.

Re: N.S.A. Devises Radio Pathway Into Computers

#46

Post by lancewiggs »

conductor wrote: post #20
staunch wrote: post #2

This sounds like a non-issue to me. Any person on this site could create little USB devices for stealing data. It's nothing special or new. I thought I was going to hear that they're light years beyond Tempest[1] or something. Feels good to finally hear an NSA story that doesn't depress me. 1. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tempest_(codename)

It can be inserted by a manufacturer, as mentioned in the article. A little chip (inside the motherboard/CPU/hard disk/graphic card) with a radio module that can receive radio signals and write the received data directly into hard disk and/or RAM or read bytes from the hard disk and/or RAM and/or graphic card and transmit it back.

I imagine the widgets transmit and receive over multiple spectrums, bouncing the spectrum around as they do.

I wonder if technology now can tweak and coordinate the multiple existing radios (Wifi, bluetooth, GSM/CDMA/3G/4G etc) on phones and computers to deliver the same result.

Is that possible? Would that require changes in silicon or could it be done with baseband software changes or even above that? I have no idea frankly.

Re: N.S.A. Devises Radio Pathway Into Computers

#47

Post by skue »

todayiamme wrote: post #5

I do understand that it is now the status quo to disavow everything the NSA is, but foreign intelligence gathering is their mission and releasing these details simply doesn't help the cause of fixing the NSA's less savoury incursions. While arguably any foreign intelligence agency of note isn't going to be caught off guard by these leaks, leaking these details does offer political ammunition to the very people who st…

As upset as I am about the NSA, I agree that reports like these may be hard to justify as whistleblowing. This seems to be less about accountability and more about gawking at the NSA's toys.

I suppose the NYT could argue that this article only reiterates what was previously reported on the ANT program, and the technology disclosed in that report is over 5 years old. Still, this article may get more attention because when ANT was previously reported the media (and much of HN) got distracted by the NSA's ability to jailbreak iPhones (in 2008!) and largely ignored the passive radio-based technology that was also described.

Re: N.S.A. Devises Radio Pathway Into Computers

#48

Post by PythonicAlpha »

samstave wrote: post #45
codex wrote: post #37

This is another example of how Snowden has compromised national security by leaking secret information that has nothing to do with American metadata and everything to do with the NSA's charter and legal mission.

Any thought that the NSA is adding to our national security is a delusion. How about a shift in your thinking: Instead f "securing" ourselves through trillions in weapons and intel BS - why not work toward creating a better world through better systems and people? How many Norwegian terrorists have there been? Fuck the NSA.

>Any thought that the NSA is adding to our national security is a delusion.

Adding more security will make our life less and less secure. Anybody who believes, such things will stop terrorism, is just dreaming.

Re: N.S.A. Devises Radio Pathway Into Computers

#49

Post by pirateking »

lancewiggs wrote: post #46
conductor wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It can be inserted by a manufacturer, as mentioned in the article. A little chip (inside the motherboard/CPU/hard disk/graphic card) with a radio module that can receive radio signals and write the received data directly into hard disk and/or RAM or read bytes from the hard disk and/or RAM and/or graphic card and transmit it back.

I imagine the widgets transmit and receive over multiple spectrums, bouncing the spectrum around as they do. I wonder if technology now can tweak and coordinate the multiple existing radios (Wifi, bluetooth, GSM/CDMA/3G/4G etc) on phones and computers to deliver the same result. Is that possible? Would that require changes in silicon or could it be done with baseband software changes or even above that? I have no ide…

That's really interesting - radio spectrum steganography. I would think that compromise of the software network stack would be enough for such an attack.

Re: N.S.A. Devises Radio Pathway Into Computers

#50

Post by jonknee »

codex wrote: post #37

This is another example of how Snowden has compromised national security by leaking secret information that has nothing to do with American metadata and everything to do with the NSA's charter and legal mission.

It wasn't a secret to anyone who would have really wanted to know. The NYT knew for years and stayed hush to keep their access to the political establishment. I seriously doubt this is news to China, Russia, Iran, etc.
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