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Bitcoin 2014 – Top predictions

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Re: Bitcoin 2014 – Top predictions

#31
post #7

Mining: if we're to believe in free markets, fees will adjust to the amount of available CPU resources. I hope that it won't be profitable enough for people to dedicate farms to mining, but that companies with a lot of CPU power will rentabilise their spare CPU cycles by doing a bit of mining with it. This would be reassuring, as it would keep mining decentralized, which is important to maintain trust in bitcoins.

Effective CPU mining of Bitcoin ended in 2010.

Effective GPU mining ended last year.

Now only highly-specialized ASIC hardware can mine Bitcoins effectively, and even then profits are questionable at current hardware prices.

Finally, the earliest farm mining of Bitcoins that I'm aware of started back in early 2011, and probably earlier (when did ArtForz start?).

Re: Bitcoin 2014 – Top predictions

#32
Predictions are basically hopes. When you look at them rationally, they are rarely based on facts but intuition. On this list:

1. More than $100M of venture capital will flow into Bitcoin start-ups.

No it won't because if you ask VCs they will mostly tell you that the value can not be extracted easily into fiat currency and that's what they need to still work in.

To that argument, some will say "BTC-only VCs" will emerge which is a regulatory nightmare, so would be restricted to angels only, or that the money will flow into making BTCFiat exchange easier, but that needs buy-in from the banks, and the moment they decide it's safe to do, they'll just do it themselves so there is no market for it.

Investing in BTC startups is a risky business as it is. Putting $100mm into them would be seen by the VC industry as positively insane.

2. Mining ‘will not’ be dead

If you run the numbers, it's of marginal profitability at best right now (and in most legal use cases is a negative - you need to steal power from somewhere, basically), and the miners aren't doing their maths very well. The poster's opinion that smaller enterprises will move their mining out to the cloud means they haven't done the maths either.

3. There will be less than 5 alt-coins (out of the 50+ in existence) that will survive 2014

This made me laugh. The fact alt-coins exist at all shows how the value of BTC is being misunderstood by both sides of the "is this tulipmania or a revolution?" debate.

The advantage of BTC is that it's a decentralised "currency" based on open source algorithms and a network of workers validating itself, which can be easily replicated.

The disadvantage of BTC is it's a decentralised "currency" based on open source algorithms and a network of workers validating itself, which can be easily replicated.

It's biggest strength is also it's biggest weakness.

If you can't see that strength as a massive weakness, ask yourselves what value BTC intrinsically has over other alt-coins.

If you follow that argument down the inevitable rabbit hole you will eventually rationalise that the value is based on perception, much like fiat currencies of the modern era, and you will start hankering for the gold standard.

Except the perception of fiat currencies is so strong it is unlikely to be undermined by the majority. Is that true of BTC?

In essence, BTC will remain strong as long as people believe it will remain strong. But the moment the majority flip, or switch to an alt-coin like Litecoin, etc. then what value will it retain?

4. Bitcoin community will solve problems including that of ‘anonymity’

Anonymity is not the problem banks and governments are truly concerned about. If it were, cash would be phased out by governments just as much as BTC would be blocked. In general they are undecided but wary of BTC because it has all the hallmarks of a Ponzi scheme with mysterious founders who do not make their intentions known.

It is accountability of the system that is of concern, not accountability of the transactions within it.

5. US, China and other global forces will not be at the forefront of Bitcoin adoption

If you think that the US, China and other countries are "global forces" you need to look at corporate entities more and ask who has the money and who has the debt.

Either way, the fact that BTC could be a private currency that lets corporations run free from government control and "tyrannical" central banks is just going to force more legislation outlawing BTC transactions.

6. Indian ecosystem will be slow to evolve; limited to speculators and mining pools

As indeed will the rest of the World. There are no pure consumers in the BTC space - everybody in the BTC ecosystem right now is a miner or a speculator or both, and the transactions are a side effect of suddenly having a lot of "money" that can't be easily turned into fiat currency.

There are few people - if any at all - who are using BTC because they perceive it as better for day to day transactions than fiat currency, because for the most part it is not.

7. The use of Bitcoin will evolve beyond ‘store of value’ or ‘transactions’

Adding metadata to the BTC blockchain is mildly interesting. Using the protocol for other purposes outside of the BTC transaction block chain (messaging, etc.) is much more interesting.

I have no doubt that the true value of BTC is the protocol that might inspire all sorts of wonderful P2P applications to emerge, but I don't think it's clear right now that any of them still lasting in 10-20 years will be currency.

8. The ‘browser’ of Bitcoin will come this year

By definition if you make a system easier to use, you have to make it less secure. If this happens, we can expect many more "somebody stole my BTC because I left my web browser open" stories.

Banks serve a useful purpose with BTC: they keep money safe. BTC needs something like banks to emerge, and that defeats part of the point of BTC.

And of course, it's virtually impossible for BTC banks to operate because they can't provide interest (BTC is designed to be anti-inflationary, and therefore by definition the concept of interest is hard to fit into the scheme of things), so people will either need to continue to struggle or we'll see value being stolen regularly.

9. The price of Bitcoin is likely to range between $4000-5000 by the end of 2014

You could literally use a RNG to come up with predictions for 2014 highs this year on BTC. Here are 10 I just came up with, and all of them are equally valid: $0, $12, $87, $479, $2065, $3535, $5566, $9233, $65136, $72612. Pick one, it's your prediction for the year. Well done.

And it's that uncertainty that is driven by the fact the whole damned thing has so little liquidity and so much "value" is being sat on by speculators who could start a rush in under an hour, that makes it so hard for people to see BTC as viable long-term.

That then causes the effect that it is unlikely to ever become viable long-term.

10. Last but not the least – Satoshi nakamoto will be Time’s Person of the Year 2014.

Possibly, but I'm not sure if they give that award to ponzi scheme creators, so until they're certain it's not a ponzi scheme, aint going to happen.

Re: Bitcoin 2014 – Top predictions

#33
post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You have to be really bearish on Bitcoin to think that a practically-identical joke currency will do better than something attracting venture capital. Nobody would trust a lolcat with their money much less a shibe. Of course, if I'm wrong then I will definitely say 'wow'; also, 'so fail' and 'much humble pie'.

>Nobody would trust a lolcat with their money much less a shibe. Don't get me wrong; I'm not saying Dogecoin will pivot into a serious currency. I'm talking strictly relative growth here, and BTC is currently over 1000x bigger. I think it'll become a defacto tipping currency of the net, and there's plenty of room for the market cap to grow to support just that niche, if it goes relatively mainstream. As far as VC mon…

Speaking of dogecoin, I want to pick up some dogecoin without any bitcoin on hand to trade and without elevating my risk to fraud any more than necessary. I realize there are forums and presumably faqs, possibly "the same way you'd pick up bitcoin," but what is the HN prescription to go about doing this? Given that it's relatively nascent, low turnover, goofy and so forth, I'm apprehensive when hearing "very coinbase, wow" elsewhere.

I also realize I should find something else to do, but... I love that friggin' dog.

Tl;dr this article neglects to mention the viability of dogecoin on 2014 due to idiots like me. It appears I'm not the only one..

Re: Bitcoin 2014 – Top predictions

#34

Here's one that I'm sure I'm going to regret saying publicly later. But, here goes: Dogecoin will outperform Bitcoin in terms of percentage market cap growth in 2014. Even if both are negative.

Dogecoin's transaction volume has been higher than Bitcoin for the past few days: http://bitinfocharts.com/comparison/transactions-btc-doge.ht... . Of course, Bitcoin doesn't take into account off-chain transactions, which at this stage is probably higher than Dogecoin's. The high tx volume is most likely due to all the tipping happening with it.

I was under the impression that all bitcoin transactions were on-chain. How do off-chain transactions work?

Re: Bitcoin 2014 – Top predictions

#36
post #22

Here's one that I'm sure I'm going to regret saying publicly later. But, here goes: Dogecoin will outperform Bitcoin in terms of percentage market cap growth in 2014. Even if both are negative.

History has shown that there are a lot of "greedy", but dumb people. A fantastic example comes to mind: In the Netherlands we have a saying "to sell fried air" (Gebakken lucht verkopen) to explain someone selling bullshit. Yet, in the "dotcom"-hype, there was a Dutch company selling shares for their startup, "f/ried air" and people got in line to buy these shares. http://www.museumofhoaxes.com/hoax/af_database/permal…

Fried air or not. It's being used by a lot of people on Reddit now to give and receive tips. Every day new merchants start accepting Dogecoin. It's excellent to accept micropayments!

Re: Bitcoin 2014 – Top predictions

#37
post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Dogecoin's transaction volume has been higher than Bitcoin for the past few days: http://bitinfocharts.com/comparison/transactions-btc-doge.ht... . Of course, Bitcoin doesn't take into account off-chain transactions, which at this stage is probably higher than Dogecoin's. The high tx volume is most likely due to all the tipping happening with it.

I was under the impression that all bitcoin transactions were on-chain. How do off-chain transactions work?

All transactions on/within exchanges are off chain.

Re: Bitcoin 2014 – Top predictions

#38
post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Nobody would trust a lolcat with their money much less a shibe. Don't get me wrong; I'm not saying Dogecoin will pivot into a serious currency. I'm talking strictly relative growth here, and BTC is currently over 1000x bigger. I think it'll become a defacto tipping currency of the net, and there's plenty of room for the market cap to grow to support just that niche, if it goes relatively mainstream. As far as VC mon…

Speaking of dogecoin, I want to pick up some dogecoin without any bitcoin on hand to trade and without elevating my risk to fraud any more than necessary. I realize there are forums and presumably faqs, possibly "the same way you'd pick up bitcoin," but what is the HN prescription to go about doing this? Given that it's relatively nascent, low turnover, goofy and so forth, I'm apprehensive when hearing "very coinbase…

Even with only a Core i5 CPU, you can use cpuminer to create some yourself.

For small amounts, you could go to http://www.reddit.com/r/dogemarket, the fraud risk is not very high there. In the US, there's https://www.altquick.co/. Other than that, you need BTC/LTC first then trade on cryptsy.

Re: Bitcoin 2014 – Top predictions

#39

Predictions are basically hopes. When you look at them rationally, they are rarely based on facts but intuition. On this list: 1. More than $100M of venture capital will flow into Bitcoin start-ups. No it won't because if you ask VCs they will mostly tell you that the value can not be extracted easily into fiat currency and that's what they need to still work in. To that argument, some will say "BTC-only VCs" will em…

>If you can't see that strength as a massive weakness, ask yourselves what value BTC intrinsically has over other alt-coins.

That's an easy one: the network effect (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Network_effect). Same why you cannot simply start another successful social web and eat Facebook's lunch.

Re: Bitcoin 2014 – Top predictions

#40

Predictions are basically hopes. When you look at them rationally, they are rarely based on facts but intuition. On this list: 1. More than $100M of venture capital will flow into Bitcoin start-ups. No it won't because if you ask VCs they will mostly tell you that the value can not be extracted easily into fiat currency and that's what they need to still work in. To that argument, some will say "BTC-only VCs" will em…

Most of your points are reasonable, but your last ruined it all for me.

> I'm not sure if they give that award to ponzi scheme creators

A Ponzi scheme requires new money all the time for it to continue. If new money stops going into Bitcoin, it's not doomed to collapse like an actual Ponzi scheme. Bitcoin is not a Ponzi scheme.

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