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Female Founders

paulgraham.com

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Re: Female Founders

#581

Post by Crake »

heterogenic wrote: post #432
Gigablah wrote: post #428

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"mansplaining"? "boys"? Are you serious?

Totally serious. Try to imagine reading this as a female developer/founder. It's not that it's all crazy/insulting/aaargh, but enough is. And it's happening without our input. So. Frustrating.

There are women in YC, as seen in comments above. Nice of you to declare their input absolutely worthless.

You'll be more successful if you don't hallucinate sexism where there isn't any. Plenty of women in the tech field manage to do this. There's no reason you can't, too. I hope you come to feel more comfortable with your place in tech in the future, because the "all men are out to get us" mindset espoused by modern mainstream feminism has a very severe and debilitating effect on women's careers.

Re: Female Founders

#582

Post by callmeed »

mikeleeorg wrote: post #213

My main takeaway from reading this article and the comments here is: The awareness of this problem is still very nascent and more & more solutions are emerging, as are criticisms of people who are beginning to acknowledge this problem. To hopefully steer this in another direction, and because I have a little girl, what are some resources you all have seen that can help girls become interested and go into technical di…

http://railsgirls.org

Re: Female Founders

#583

Post by fikhma »

_xhok wrote: post #456

One thing that happens in American public schools is that because they're so worried about catching the average student up, exceptional students feel bored. Male here; question for females: is something similar happening now? That is, is it the case that so many programs are catered to stereotypically feminine girls that girls who just want to, independent of their gender, learn how to code, are feeling unaccounted f…

There are no female readers on HN. And there are no male readers on Jezebel.

This is the truth.

Re: Female Founders

#584

Post by eruditely »

mcantelon wrote: post #269
cynicalkane wrote: post #233

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is the shallowness of that kind of P.C. bullying--Paul Graham has done much more for women in technology than any Internet bully, but he will continue to be attacked because it is possible to assign uncharitable interpretations to a few things he said once. When one realizes that this whole kerfuffle is not about being pro-woman, it's about posturing such that one appears to be pro-woman, then the attackers' vie…

I'm reminded of Ted Kaczynski's take on P.C. activism: "Leftists may claim that their activism is motivated by compassion or by moral principle, and moral principle does play a role for the leftist of the oversocialized type. But compassion and moral principle cannot be the main motives for leftist activism. Hostility is too prominent a component of leftist behavior; so is the drive for power. Moreover, much leftist…

Title of the link I am providing

"Psychological assessment of the unabomber"

Here are the first few parts of the text

>"Dr. Sally C. Johnson's psychological report describes Theodore Kaczynski, the confessed Unabomber, as a man whose early brilliance was ruined by paranoid schizophrenia.

>"Johnson made her evaluation after interviewing Kaczynski, his family and people who knew him, analyzing psychological tests, and studing of the Unabomber's journals which document over 40 years of his life."

>"She cites "an almost total absence of interpersonal relationships," and "delusional thinking involving being controlled by modern technology" as examples of his illness."

http://www.paulcooijmans.com/psychology/unabombreport.html

below is a commentary by Paul Cooijmans on the report itself you might as well read that if you are lazy http://www.paulcooijmans.com/psychology/unabomber.html

Re: Female Founders

#585

Post by wpietri »

jacobtracey wrote: post #578
wpietri wrote: post #576

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So your theory is that when I note my privilege, I am vilifying... myself? I don't think that's what's going on at all. Privilege checklists, for example, are written by and for privileged people: http://geekfeminism.wikia.com/wiki/Privilege_checklist Maybe the term is muddled for you, but for me it's a pretty specific technical term, and most usages of it I see are pretty accurate. I think the "disadvantage" term ca…

No, that is not what I said. I said calling it privilege only stands as a reason to vilify a group. Whether or not you choose to do that is up to you. You and many others seem to have taken the tact of creating a sense of responsibility to those who you deem to be privileged based on something they have had zero control over - their name, gender or ethnic backgrounds. The focus of anyone interested in social equality…

You seem to have a lot of opinions on the right way to do this. What experience do you have that would encourage others to give weight to your opinions? Perhaps you can share a couple of your notable successes and a couple of instructive failures.

Having talked with a lot of people you consider "disadvantaged" about this, they mostly disagree with you. As do plenty of other people.

I personally find the framing of privilege useful in evaluating and improving my own actions, as well as evaluating the actions of others. Having never heard of Peggy McIntosh before this moment, I can confidently say that I'm not really interested in her definitions of who's privileged and who's not.

Having been born white, I do of course recognize that I didn't pick that. I don't think people are responsible for things they have zero control over. But when those things give them power, I do think they are responsible for how they use it.

Re: Female Founders

#586

Post by mcantelon »

eruditely wrote: post #584
mcantelon wrote: post #269

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm reminded of Ted Kaczynski's take on P.C. activism: "Leftists may claim that their activism is motivated by compassion or by moral principle, and moral principle does play a role for the leftist of the oversocialized type. But compassion and moral principle cannot be the main motives for leftist activism. Hostility is too prominent a component of leftist behavior; so is the drive for power. Moreover, much leftist…

Title of the link I am providing "Psychological assessment of the unabomber" Here are the first few parts of the text >"Dr. Sally C. Johnson's psychological report describes Theodore Kaczynski, the confessed Unabomber, as a man whose early brilliance was ruined by paranoid schizophrenia. >"Johnson made her evaluation after interviewing Kaczynski, his family and people who knew him, analyzing psychological tests, and…

Evidence suggests Kaczynski participated in MKULTRA:

http://www.theatlantic.com/past/docs/issues/2000/06/chase.ht...

If so, this would have been a likely explanation for his chosen direction.

Re: Female Founders

#587

Post by jacobtracey »

wpietri wrote: post #585
jacobtracey wrote: post #578

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, that is not what I said. I said calling it privilege only stands as a reason to vilify a group. Whether or not you choose to do that is up to you. You and many others seem to have taken the tact of creating a sense of responsibility to those who you deem to be privileged based on something they have had zero control over - their name, gender or ethnic backgrounds. The focus of anyone interested in social equality…

You seem to have a lot of opinions on the right way to do this. What experience do you have that would encourage others to give weight to your opinions? Perhaps you can share a couple of your notable successes and a couple of instructive failures. Having talked with a lot of people you consider "disadvantaged" about this, they mostly disagree with you. As do plenty of other people. I personally find the framing of pr…

My experience is that of a white male. Does that make my opinions or viewpoint any less valid in your eyes?

I've expressed one opinion on 'the right way to do this'. Help the disadvantaged - and don't vilify those with perceived advantages that they have no control over.

I could ask the exact same thing of your background and why you feel that your opinion is more valid than mine, but instead I'd prefer to address the content of what you're saying, rather than what your background is.

I have also talked with a lot of people that I consider "disadvantaged", and they do agree with me. As do plenty of other people.

The Geekfeminism wiki page that you linked lists Peggy McIntosh's article "White Privilege: Unpacking the Invisible Knapsack", which was the first 'Privilege checklist'.

I'm surprised you haven't even bothered to read the original writing that frames the world view you've accepted as fact.

Re: Female Founders

#588

Post by theorique »

wpietri wrote: post #544
theorique wrote: post #531

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Asians throw the "white privilege" theory for a loop, because they face the same challenges as other people of color, and yet still manage to succeed admirably. Victim-lovers don't like them for that very reason, because they don't play very good racial victims - they are too busy succeeding.

Not at all. That one group has privilege doesn't mean no other group can. Here, for example, is a programmer talking about how he was privileged for looking like an Asian guy: http://pgbovine.net/tech-privilege.htm White privilege by the way, isn't a theory. It's a fact. E.g.: http://www.nber.org/papers/w9873 Or, more entertainingly: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TG4f9zR5yzY

The Asian article was interesting. It is, however, downplayed

I still don't buy the whole white privilege concept as something distinct from being a simple numerical majority. One paper on some exaggerated African sounding names compared to some typical English names does not prove a whole lot. Among other things, There would need to be a control group with some names that sound both (1) white and (2) strange to English speaking ears.

Obviously, there are advantages to being white in this society as Louis CK points out, just as there are advantages to being black, and advantages to being Asian. Yet almost no one talks about black privilege, or Asian privilege. Except possibly Gavin McInnes, and then only ironically, as a comment on white privilege: http://takimag.com/article/tackling_asian_privilege_gavin_mc...

Re: Female Founders

#589

Post by sanxiyn »

thenomad wrote: post #240
matthewmacleod wrote: post #162

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Less than 10% of nurses in the United States are male. Why isn't there a hue and cry about this gender imbalance? Is it even a real problem? There is, but you're probably not that exposed to it often by dint of (presumably) not being part of that industry. But if you look into it, there's concern about the lack of male nurses and a concerted effort to improve diversity (the same for other professions with traditional…

Really? That's very good news, and I hadn't heard about it at all. Do you have some links to orgs working to get more men into female-skewed professions? I'd be very interested to read them.

Quick Google search turned up http://menteach.org/ for example, founded in 1979 to get more men into teaching.

Frankly, organizations working to get more men into teaching or nursing is so easy to find by Google, I think people claiming otherwise should be assumed to have agenda. I am starting to suspect these are intentional trolling.

Re: Female Founders

#590

Post by aaren »

theorique wrote: post #588
wpietri wrote: post #544

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not at all. That one group has privilege doesn't mean no other group can. Here, for example, is a programmer talking about how he was privileged for looking like an Asian guy: http://pgbovine.net/tech-privilege.htm White privilege by the way, isn't a theory. It's a fact. E.g.: http://www.nber.org/papers/w9873 Or, more entertainingly: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TG4f9zR5yzY

The Asian article was interesting. It is, however, downplayed I still don't buy the whole white privilege concept as something distinct from being a simple numerical majority. One paper on some exaggerated African sounding names compared to some typical English names does not prove a whole lot. Among other things, There would need to be a control group with some names that sound both (1) white and (2) strange to Engl…

How about Sunni / Shia muslims in Iraq under Saddam? The Shia population is by far the majority, but Saddam was Sunni. The Ba'ath party violently persecuted the Shia popluation. I think it is safe to say that you would be privileged to be Sunni in this population, even though they by no means constituted the majority.

There are advantages to being members of all sorts of groups, but the advantage of being a member of SWM is particularly strong and has been quantified widely [1].

[1]: http://www.jimchines.com/2012/05/facts-are-cool/

edit: Perhaps you were limiting your first statement to within particular groups, e.g. tech, where there is a majority of SWM. The thing is, a majority of the privileged group is what you'd expect, right?

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