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The $200 Billion Rip-Off: Our broadband future was stolen (2007)

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Re: The $200 Billion Rip-Off: Our broadband future was stolen (2007)

#241
post #220

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I knew someone would come up with the granuality argument. The rest of the world works exactly the same way too. Yes, there are places in the us that have little violent crime. There are more places like that outside the US though, and taking population into account my point stands.

Of course the rest of the world works the same way too. I never said it didn't. But the fact remains that most of the US does not suffer from extreme violence, and comparing the averages across countries doesn't do anything to dispute that. Even though you claim to understand this, you didn't let it stop you from declaring that "most of the US does have a higher murder rate." How does that work, then?

Even though you claim to understand this, you didn't let it stop you from declaring that "most of the US does have a higher murder rate." How does that work, then?

In areas of similar population density, the murder rate in the US is higher.

Of course there are areas of the US that have very low population density, and an equally low murder rate.

Re: The $200 Billion Rip-Off: Our broadband future was stolen (2007)

#242
post #229

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> BULL and SHIT. In Australia, there is no routine pixellation of middle fingers, likewise pixellating the mouth of someone swearing. We don't ban whole works. Australia does. > Hell, even movie ratings are a form of censorship, Nonsense. Self-imposed rating systems are in no way comparable to governmental censorship. > Some US states prevent atheists from holding political office Wrong. Those laws may be on the book…

-- We don't ban whole works. Australia does. Name some that have happened in the past couple of decades, given that this was your initial point of note. Then explain to me how those particular selected works are anything but a narrow gap between the US and Australia, in real terms rather than purity of ideology. And need I remind you again about IP laws? Lifetime of author plus 70 years is a very real ban on associat…

> And need I remind you again about IP laws?

Not relevant. This doesn't ban content, just the reproduction of specific works.

> So, Australia has the principle of being able to ban entire works and yet doesn't ban anything.

You literally just contradicted yourself, when you mentioned a work that Australia did ban.

> partial censorship is okay

It is when you can evade it entirely by releasing an 'unrated' version of your movie, as is common practice in this country and has been for years.

> On the other hand, states in the US have laws stating that you can't take office if you are an atheist.

Outdated laws nobody would dare enforce, given the hugely expensive legal case which would result.

And, no, I never said it was fine and dandy. Stop putting words in my mouth. Every country has a sordid history which it needs to move past. Or do I need to remind you of the Stolen Generation?

> I didn't say anything about principles. I was talking about idealism being tested. These are not the same thing.

You are trying to draw a distinction based on absolutely nothing. The words mean the same damn thing.

> You have a pretty tortured definition of racism, if it requires the banning of face veils before it's a problem.

I never said this. I said that institutional racism is pretty damned bad when people can't even dress the way they want without being punished for it.

Every country has racism problems. At least in the US, we admit it without trying to claim our racism isn't racist.

> in the US, despite your puritanical ideal of free speech, you have a whole selection of two political parties to vote for

Or not vote for. You know, we have the freedom to not vote in this country, which seems to be foreign to the Australian mindset.

And, if having umpty-dozen parties is so great, how come the only ones who get elected are the ones that censor the damned Internet?

Re: The $200 Billion Rip-Off: Our broadband future was stolen (2007)

#243
post #229

Earlier quoted context omitted.

-- We don't ban whole works. Australia does. Name some that have happened in the past couple of decades, given that this was your initial point of note. Then explain to me how those particular selected works are anything but a narrow gap between the US and Australia, in real terms rather than purity of ideology. And need I remind you again about IP laws? Lifetime of author plus 70 years is a very real ban on associat…

> And need I remind you again about IP laws? Not relevant. This doesn't ban content, just the reproduction of specific works. > So, Australia has the principle of being able to ban entire works and yet doesn't ban anything. You literally just contradicted yourself, when you mentioned a work that Australia did ban. > partial censorship is okay It is when you can evade it entirely by releasing an 'unrated' version of y…

I note with some amusement that this is my third account, after my previous two (chbarts and derleth) were hellbanned. Can we really not have a debate here without relegating one side to the Land of Wind and Ghosts?

Re: The $200 Billion Rip-Off: Our broadband future was stolen (2007)

#244
post #241

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Of course the rest of the world works the same way too. I never said it didn't. But the fact remains that most of the US does not suffer from extreme violence, and comparing the averages across countries doesn't do anything to dispute that. Even though you claim to understand this, you didn't let it stop you from declaring that "most of the US does have a higher murder rate." How does that work, then?

Even though you claim to understand this, you didn't let it stop you from declaring that "most of the US does have a higher murder rate." How does that work, then? In areas of similar population density, the murder rate in the US is higher. Of course there are areas of the US that have very low population density, and an equally low murder rate.

First we get "most of the US has a higher murder rate", then we transition to "the average is higher is the vast majority of US states" and now we're at "in areas of similar population density".

I really can't keep track of just what you're actually arguing, nor do I care to keep trying.

Re: The $200 Billion Rip-Off: Our broadband future was stolen (2007)

#245

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree with your entire comment, but the "Rather Big Brotherish" part made me laugh, considering the recent NSA scandal, and the fact that the entire public is basically carrying around a 'telescreen' for all intents and purposes. Off-topic but funny in and of itself. Also a small note, but even in America some places view face coverings with extreme caution, wearing one in a bank for instance is a big no-no. Not a…

None of this is relevant. You can't argue the actual points, so you descend to irrelevancies.

As stated in the first sentence... I wasn't arguing against your points.

Re: The $200 Billion Rip-Off: Our broadband future was stolen (2007)

#246
post #103
post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't get all the apologies in this thread. The US is a great country! Has its warts, but I've lived in Europe, and I've been to Australia, and I wouldn't live anywhere else. It's the maverick, can-do entrepreneurial spirit that's more prevalent among Americans and the rich cultural diversity that comes with being a melting pot that I love about this country. Outside of a few bad spots in a few cities, it's one of…

I'm replying to digisign - I would argue that it's the media that's stirring that anger up and the fact that partisan hacks turn every small thing into an OUTRAGE more than everything truly being outrageous.

Thats what I mean by "obfuscating...", i.e. distracting.
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