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4K is for programmers

tiamat.tsotech.com

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Re: 4K is for programmers

#71

Post by interpol_p »

dllthomas wrote: post #63
interpol_p wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

While I do a lot on the terminal, not everything is faster there. Jumping between symbols in your IDE is not going to happen faster on the command line because it's a spatial operation. You've located the symbol visually, clicking it to jump to definition is far faster than keyboard-navigating to it, or even typing it. Merging is better with a dedicated merge tool than a command line merge. I have to resolve conflict…

"Merging is better with a dedicated merge tool than a command line merge. I have to resolve conflicts one to three times per day and I couldn't imagine a non-visual merge interface for complex files where manual edits from both sides are necessary. Being able to see it all at once helps." Being able to see it all at once absolutely helps, but on a big enough console you can see it all just fine. Vimdiff is great. A l…

Fair enough, I normally use DiffMerge and find it fairly quick at pulling relevant sections from the files being merged. But I agree that the three pane preview is a must.

Re: 4K is for programmers

#72

Post by xmlninja »

GigabyteCoin wrote: post #52
bhauer wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I took this as a bit ironic because my writing style was tamer in years past and I feel it has become more blunt (to use another euphemism) since I started reading more Hacker News postings. But yes, it's opinionated. I'm quite strongly of the opinion that in general larger desktop displays increase productivity. They are finally arriving, and at prices that are almost affordable. With several important caveats and w…

Hey, no worries! There is a time and place for everything. I am not criticizing your writing style. I just found it odd to find one like it at the top of HN is all.

Because this kind of writing style makes people with different opinions frustrated which leads to discussions and debates.

I actually like it. It reminds me of kenrockwell.com

Re: 4K is for programmers

#73

Post by silon3 »

nsxwolf wrote: post #66

30Hz is a dealbreaker. I will keep my 1920x1200 until I can have a proper 4K display. I really am surprised there are people who can tolerate that refresh rate on a desktop.

"Proper" includes 16:10 or even better (15:10 would be great)

Re: 4K is for programmers

#74

Post by vonseel »

Well, this is just about the opposite of what many people have been moving towards for the past decade (smaller, more portable, lighter).

I do think a single large monitor would be nice. I'm using dual 24's with a 13" retina display centered below and find it difficult to make smart use of the screen space because I have to turn my head constantly.

Re: 4K is for programmers

#75

Post by johndriscoll »

interpol_p wrote: post #56
johndriscoll wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I do all these things in a terminal. I used not to. But once I started doing things the CLI-way, I never looked back and have yet to discover a tool offering even half the productivity gained from keeping my fingers firmly planted on the home row. However, if you are locked into using an environment where doing the things you've said requires mousing or multiple windows with tons of resolution, then you have my sympa…

While I do a lot on the terminal, not everything is faster there. Jumping between symbols in your IDE is not going to happen faster on the command line because it's a spatial operation. You've located the symbol visually, clicking it to jump to definition is far faster than keyboard-navigating to it, or even typing it. Merging is better with a dedicated merge tool than a command line merge. I have to resolve conflict…

Although I don't have any problem stitching side-by-side commits in a terminal, or keeping multiple text buffers akimbo in general (its what the terminal is ideal for), I can't argue with most of your points because you're probably 100% correct in the context of your environment and it's limited modes of input (mouse-centric). And you have my sympathies. Being forced to use the mouse is a drag, and I would argue, a cruel thing to do to users from an accessibility standpoint. This (without going deeply into it) is what ultimately binds me to my "limited" set of inputs: keystroke. Yet being bound to the keyboard interface has only helped my productivity. When I get improperly formatted assets from my designer (i know, right?) I can actually do all manipulation, resizing, splitting, converting from the CLI faster than I can send ze an email! (even some minor visual stuff! but my designer fucking hates when i do that so i tend not to anymore.)

But your environment and my environment are likely completely different and YMMV.

Re: 4K is for programmers

#76

Post by wtallis »

oakwhiz wrote: post #42
XorNot wrote: post #30

"Seiki is missing a golden opportunity to dominate the desktop display market by removing the television tuner, speakers, and remote, and then reallocating that budget to a 60Hz or better input (HDMI 2 and/or DisplayPort), a matte screen surface, and instant-on DPMI support, all the while retaining the market-wrecking price." And while we're at it, I want a unicorn as well! Seriously, speakers, a remote and a TV tune…

I believe IBM produced a high resolution monitor which was a single panel, but acted as if it were 4 smaller displays, complete with 4 separate display input cables. Something similar could technically be done to re-use lower-res, but higher-speed existing display controller parts on 4K panels.

Some of the 4k displays out there are literally two panels glued together. Fortunately, DisplayPort supports multiple displays per connection, but DP hubs are expensive, presumably even if they're internal to the monitor. I'm not sure that using this feature would work for having two chips drive a single monolithic panel.

Re: 4K is for programmers

#77

Post by pedalpete »

I don't really understand monitor specs, is the 30mhz limit due to the size of the monitor, or is it a GPU limitation on most PCs?

I'm wondering if a 4k 36" monitor would have a better 40mhz limit or something?

Also, my laptop is a few years old with Intel HD integrated graphics. Any idea if it would have enough power to run one of these?

What about a ChromeBook?

I'm trying to get an idea of just how much power these things need?

Re: 4K is for programmers

#78

Post by hkmurakami »

xmlninja wrote: post #72
GigabyteCoin wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hey, no worries! There is a time and place for everything. I am not criticizing your writing style. I just found it odd to find one like it at the top of HN is all.

Because this kind of writing style makes people with different opinions frustrated which leads to discussions and debates. I actually like it. It reminds me of kenrockwell.com

A debate without the accompanying upvotes would trigger the flamewar penalty though.

Re: 4K is for programmers

#79

Post by lstamour »

pedalpete wrote: post #77

I don't really understand monitor specs, is the 30mhz limit due to the size of the monitor, or is it a GPU limitation on most PCs? I'm wondering if a 4k 36" monitor would have a better 40mhz limit or something? Also, my laptop is a few years old with Intel HD integrated graphics. Any idea if it would have enough power to run one of these? What about a ChromeBook? I'm trying to get an idea of just how much power these…

The panel is capable of 120hz on both 39" and 55" but the 39" is further restricted to 60hz at all resolutions. The limit at 4K to 30hz is the HDMI connection. The TV does not have DisplayPort, though HDMI 2 is hoped for in a future firmware update. (At least based on Sony's announcement of such an firmware update for their sets.)

Re: 4K is for programmers

#80

Post by harpastum »

mproud wrote: post #68

Whatever. It’s not the number of pixels, it’s the pixel density that’s important. Higher density is what is going to make text and pictures better. At 39″, that’s 113 ppi. Anyone can rig up a multi-monitor display setup with higher ppi. The only advancement is one physical screen that a good number of GPUs can’t take advantage of. For comparison, my Retina 13″ MacBook Pro has 2560x1440, 2.5K (or really ⅔ 4K) but at 2…

The real factor is pixels per degree of your vision, not ppi. Viewing distance range with phones and laptops is pretty limited (an arm's length), but with a monitor you can simply move it farther away on the desk to increase the perceived pixel density.

Of course, moving the monitor farther away also makes the perceived monitor size smaller. since PPI and distance can be traded one for the other, what ends up mattering is the total resolution. 4k is a lot of pixels.

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