What is it like to be a geek in a prison? • Hacker News Board

Re: What is it like to be a geek in a prison?

#111

Post by rolux » Thu, Dec 26, 2013, 8:14 PM UTC

swalkergibson wrote: post #100

berntb wrote: post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

From a Scandinavian viewpoint, the US prison system looks like the 19th century in many ways. I have no problem with that, longer sentences for repeat offenders with many crimes would be better than rebates(!) on prison time, like in Sweden. Point is, I'm not that judgmental and still I say: Not trying to rehabilitate prisoners so they have good job skills is obviously insane. And totally immoral. More of the prisone…

> Some economic interest in getting repeat offenders back into prison. Interestingly enough, this actually exists in the US. As crazy as it sounds, there are private prisons that are paid on a per-inmate basis. These corporations typically put their political donations behind candidates who are "tough on crime" to fill their jails and line their pockets. It would be terribly interesting to see what kind of impact the…

Indeed:

"In 2012, [the Corrections Corporations of America] sent a letter to 'prison officials in 48 states offering to buy prisons from these states in exchange for a 20-year management contract and a guaranteed occupancy rate of 90%.'"

(http://www.annarbor.com/news/opinion/passing-house-bill-will...)

Re: What is it like to be a geek in a prison?

#112

Post by DrJokepu » Thu, Dec 26, 2013, 8:15 PM UTC

kybernetyk wrote: post #104

deftnerd wrote: post #57

I am a developer/hacker who spent 6 months in prison about a decade ago. They had a room of old broken computers that were donated and I offered to fix them up in exchange for increased library privileges. Normally inmates could only visit the library once a week and check out two books, but I read about 4 books a day during my time there. I fixed up the computers and supported them once they got a teacher, read my b…

> The obvious downside is that prison sticks to you for the rest of your life What don't you move to Europe? There your US criminal records don't interest anybody - only in security relevant jobs. So just don't apply for jobs with banks, etc.

Assuming that OP has no EU citizenship I imagine it would be very, very difficult to obtain a (work) visa with a a US criminal record. Showing that you have no criminal record in any of the countries you have lived in the last X years is a standard part of visa applications anywhere.

Re: What is it like to be a geek in a prison?

#113

Post by deftnerd » Thu, Dec 26, 2013, 8:24 PM UTC

swalkergibson wrote: post #106

deftnerd wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It was a plea bargain. At the time, after 6 months of dealing with an overpowering sense of being crushed by the legal system, I just took the first plea bargain they offered me. It was the exact same deal they gave the person who actually committed the robbery. The anxiety of not knowing what the future held made it seem to be a relief to just get things concluded. Also, as an 18-year-old, I wasn't thinking about my…

That is really terrifying. I apologize for all of the personal questions, but what were you facing if you went to trial? I am fascinated by this. Honestly, it sounds like you were the victim of one-size-fits-all justice...

I'm not a shy person about personal details. They were threatening to give me 99 years in prison for Aggravated Robbery, which is a Class 1 felony, merely because of my inadvertent involvement in the crime. That's on the same level as murder and all of those frightening things.

The Jurisdiction was Williamson county, a neighboring county of Austin, TX. They are well-known for their no leniency attitudes.

Re: What is it like to be a geek in a prison?

#114

Post by deftnerd » Thu, Dec 26, 2013, 8:26 PM UTC

DrJokepu wrote: post #112

kybernetyk wrote: post #104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The obvious downside is that prison sticks to you for the rest of your life What don't you move to Europe? There your US criminal records don't interest anybody - only in security relevant jobs. So just don't apply for jobs with banks, etc.

Assuming that OP has no EU citizenship I imagine it would be very, very difficult to obtain a (work) visa with a a US criminal record. Showing that you have no criminal record in any of the countries you have lived in the last X years is a standard part of visa applications anywhere.

I have come to the same conclusion with my own research. My best hope for being in the EU is if my wife gets a work visa and I just travel there as a spouse on a residents visa and don't have official employment there.

This might be an option if all of my work is done online, but it does skirt the intentions of the law and I don't like doing that for moral reasons.

Re: What is it like to be a geek in a prison?

#115

Post by Havoc » Thu, Dec 26, 2013, 8:28 PM UTC

deftnerd wrote: post #57

I am a developer/hacker who spent 6 months in prison about a decade ago. They had a room of old broken computers that were donated and I offered to fix them up in exchange for increased library privileges. Normally inmates could only visit the library once a week and check out two books, but I read about 4 books a day during my time there. I fixed up the computers and supported them once they got a teacher, read my b…

Mind explaining the part about hands behind your back?

Re: What is it like to be a geek in a prison?

#116

Post by deftnerd » Thu, Dec 26, 2013, 8:29 PM UTC

bjoe_lewis wrote: post #90

deftnerd wrote: post #57

I am a developer/hacker who spent 6 months in prison about a decade ago. They had a room of old broken computers that were donated and I offered to fix them up in exchange for increased library privileges. Normally inmates could only visit the library once a week and check out two books, but I read about 4 books a day during my time there. I fixed up the computers and supported them once they got a teacher, read my b…

That was a nice read. How exactly did your "felonious history" affect your career? Just curious, do the world of startups and hackers, actually bias on things like this?

One of the most depressing moments was when I got a high-paid and very desirable job at Dell. I was even upfront about my history with my interviewer (I've never hidden or lied about it before) who assured me that it wasn't an issue.

I was working for 3 days and was nice and comfortable in my office and made lots of friends when security arrived and escorted me to my car and told me I wasn't allowed back on Dell property because I failed my background check.

I went through enough depression at the time that I gave up on the tech sector for a few years and worked food industry.

Re: What is it like to be a geek in a prison?

#117

Post by jsmthrowaway » Thu, Dec 26, 2013, 8:30 PM UTC

deftnerd wrote: post #57

I am a developer/hacker who spent 6 months in prison about a decade ago. They had a room of old broken computers that were donated and I offered to fix them up in exchange for increased library privileges. Normally inmates could only visit the library once a week and check out two books, but I read about 4 books a day during my time there. I fixed up the computers and supported them once they got a teacher, read my b…

> Also, the stigma of having a criminal record sticks to you forever. Even now, in my middle 30's, it's nearly impossible for me to get a tech job even though my felonious history was from when I was a teenager. You pretty much have to resign yourself to the fact that you'll work at 50% of the salary as your peers or have to make your own future by starting your own companies and projects.

You do not have to resign yourself to anything. I have built a career in the valley and I am currently far above market salary doing the work that I love at a company I love. That was after starting in this industry with no demonstrable computing experience and a felony conviction after four months pretrial detention, without so much as a college degree. I have discussed my experiences before and have found that the companies that understand and work with me, oddly, end up being the places I want to work.

A record only makes you work even harder for the success that you want. I work three times harder than most coasters around me because I know I have something to prove. Resigning yourself to the impossibility of success is letting your incarceration and the system win. Never resign yourself to anything, and above all never let the system win.

Re: What is it like to be a geek in a prison?

#118

Post by S4M » Thu, Dec 26, 2013, 8:30 PM UTC

Havoc wrote: post #115

deftnerd wrote: post #57

I am a developer/hacker who spent 6 months in prison about a decade ago. They had a room of old broken computers that were donated and I offered to fix them up in exchange for increased library privileges. Normally inmates could only visit the library once a week and check out two books, but I read about 4 books a day during my time there. I fixed up the computers and supported them once they got a teacher, read my b…

Mind explaining the part about hands behind your back?

I guess the rules of the prison impose the inmates to keep their hands behind their back in front of the wardens.

Re: What is it like to be a geek in a prison?

#119

Post by deftnerd » Thu, Dec 26, 2013, 8:33 PM UTC

Havoc wrote: post #115

deftnerd wrote: post #57

I am a developer/hacker who spent 6 months in prison about a decade ago. They had a room of old broken computers that were donated and I offered to fix them up in exchange for increased library privileges. Normally inmates could only visit the library once a week and check out two books, but I read about 4 books a day during my time there. I fixed up the computers and supported them once they got a teacher, read my b…

Mind explaining the part about hands behind your back?

The kind of facility I was in was more of a place to warehouse prisoners. They housed 50 people in bunk beds in each warehouse room with no air conditioning. When we moved from the dorm to (for instance) the cafeteria, there were some required rules for the safety of the employees.

All the inmates had to be 3 feet from each other, hands clasped behind their backs, looking down.

A lot of it was purely for psychological purposes. We were never addressed by our names, just "Inmate". I asked them why they didn't just call us prisoners, and they told me that it was because we were Inmates not prisoners since we choose to be there. The not making eye-contact thing was pretty rough too.

It wasn't as out of control as the Milgram experiment or anything, but I did get the distinct impression that the person who put together the operations manuals was very well versed in some of the darker parts of psychology.

Re: What is it like to be a geek in a prison?

#120

Post by swalkergibson » Thu, Dec 26, 2013, 8:38 PM UTC

deftnerd wrote: post #113

swalkergibson wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That is really terrifying. I apologize for all of the personal questions, but what were you facing if you went to trial? I am fascinated by this. Honestly, it sounds like you were the victim of one-size-fits-all justice...

I'm not a shy person about personal details. They were threatening to give me 99 years in prison for Aggravated Robbery, which is a Class 1 felony, merely because of my inadvertent involvement in the crime. That's on the same level as murder and all of those frightening things. The Jurisdiction was Williamson county, a neighboring county of Austin, TX. They are well-known for their no leniency attitudes.

It is truly amazing how fucked up our system is. If they actually believed you "deserved" 99 years, then bargaining down to 6 months suggests that all they really care about is artificially inflating and maintaining their "conviction" rate and not actually, you know, justice or something. Thank you for sharing your experiences, I rarely get the opportunity to discuss things like this. Best of luck to you going forward!