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The real use of money is to buy freedom

paraschopra.com

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Re: The real use of money is to buy freedom

#41

Post by Joeboy »

A few years ago, after spending most of my adult life in voluntary-ish poverty I decided to spend a few years earning proper money. By which I mean, significantly more than my first world country's average salary but still peanuts in HN terms. The main differences it's made to me are:

1) I can afford to buy a home, which I expect to remove a large amount of bullshit from my life and makes me feel more secure about my future.

2) When my computer / bicycle / phone / printer / washing machine etc fails I can get the problem fixed without significant disruption to my life. This is probably a much bigger deal than anybody who's always been able to find money for these things realises.

4) It feels good to know I have earning ability if I put the effort in.

5) It's nice to be able to buy stuff, occasionally.

Re: The real use of money is to buy freedom

#42

Post by hansy »

yummyfajitas wrote: post #40
downandout wrote: post #36

The importance of money is a matter of perspective. Anyone that has the author's attitude toward money has never been poor. Ask a homeless person, or any of the 50% of the US population that has a net worth of zero or less what their opinion on money is, and it will be markedly different than the author's. The opinion that money doesn't matter is a luxury that only the wealthy can afford.

The author is from India. Based on that fact, there is a 95% chance that he lived most of his life in poverty comparable to the bottom 5% of Americans. See figure 7: http://www-wds.worldbank.org/external/default/WDSContentServ... It's also worth noting that he's writing this from the perspective of a far more materialistic and status-based society than the US.

I have grown up in a typical middle-class household where one is rightly nurtured into not being extravagant. I was taught to value money (which I thoroughly appreciate). Even though, in my childhood, I always got whatever I wanted, the truth is that I never wanted big, expensive toys.

The author did not grow up in poverty.

Re: The real use of money is to buy freedom

#43

Post by officemonkey »

Everybody just loves the word "freedom," like it's some magical super-juice which is the be-all and end-all of the American experience.

We will all be free of obligation, pain, responsibility, and any other positive or negative thing soon enough. Instead of the pursuit of freedom, we should dedicate ourselves to obligations that honor ourselves and others.

You don't really want "freedom," you want an obligation that you're excited about, you want a responsibility you're eager to take on, you want a job you love doing, you want a relationship that resonates with your values.

Everyone shorthands this to "freedom," and sooner or later that becomes the goal instead of the individual obligations you're now able to pursue.

Re: The real use of money is to buy freedom

#44

Post by downandout »

yummyfajitas wrote: post #40
downandout wrote: post #36

The importance of money is a matter of perspective. Anyone that has the author's attitude toward money has never been poor. Ask a homeless person, or any of the 50% of the US population that has a net worth of zero or less what their opinion on money is, and it will be markedly different than the author's. The opinion that money doesn't matter is a luxury that only the wealthy can afford.

The author is from India. Based on that fact, there is a 95% chance that he lived most of his life in poverty comparable to the bottom 5% of Americans. See figure 7: http://www-wds.worldbank.org/external/default/WDSContentServ... It's also worth noting that he's writing this from the perspective of a far more materialistic and status-based society than the US.

He actually mentioned in the article that he grew up "middle class". I am aware that middle class in India may be different than in the US, but it is clear that he was never poor - going to bed hungry etc.

Re: The real use of money is to buy freedom

#45

Post by nihitdesai »

"we don't build services to make money; we make money to build better services" - Mark Zuckerberg in his letter to shareholders. "I don't intend to build in order to have more clients; I intend to have more clients in order to build" - Howard Roark in Fountainhead

Re: The real use of money is to buy freedom

#46

Post by dsirijus »

Joeboy wrote: post #41

A few years ago, after spending most of my adult life in voluntary-ish poverty I decided to spend a few years earning proper money. By which I mean, significantly more than my first world country's average salary but still peanuts in HN terms. The main differences it's made to me are: 1) I can afford to buy a home, which I expect to remove a large amount of bullshit from my life and makes me feel more secure about my…

I went a similar road (from $50 a month in an underground windowless garage with no utilities whatsoever, to a 200m2 penthouse).

I'd put an accent on your point #2 - it really makes a huge difference to just shoot up some money into trivialities and mundane annoyances in your life just to make them magically go away. Because there's so many of them, most cannot afford that.

I'd like to add a point though, maybe the most important in my list.

6) increased appeal to other sex.

And as far as buying stuff goes, all my wordly posessions fit in one box less than in this picture https://www.dropbox.com/s/us8bavsdjldd029/2013-08-16%2005.42...

Re: The real use of money is to buy freedom

#47

Post by yummyfajitas »

downandout wrote: post #44
yummyfajitas wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The author is from India. Based on that fact, there is a 95% chance that he lived most of his life in poverty comparable to the bottom 5% of Americans. See figure 7: http://www-wds.worldbank.org/external/default/WDSContentServ... It's also worth noting that he's writing this from the perspective of a far more materialistic and status-based society than the US.

He actually mentioned in the article that he grew up "middle class". I am aware that middle class in India may be different than in the US, but it is clear that he was never poor - going to bed hungry etc.

"Middle class" in India does not mean what you seem to think. The vast majority of middle class Indians are poorer than most Americans living in poverty.

Read my link - 95% of Indians are poorer than the bottom 5% of Americans. Unless the author defines "middle class" as "top 2%", the fact that he grew up "middle class" is meaningless when comparing his lifestyle to an American one.

A stat to illustrate the point - 1.8% of India (circa 2009) owns a car, likely one that would be too dangerous to sell in the US. For comparison, 25% of American households below the poverty line own 2 cars and 75% own one.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_vehicles_p...

http://www.census.gov/prod/2008pubs/h150-07.pdf

The bottom 50% of America you described, or even the bottom 5%, also does not go to bed hungry.

Re: The real use of money is to buy freedom

#48

Post by hkmurakami »

officemonkey wrote: post #43

Everybody just loves the word "freedom," like it's some magical super-juice which is the be-all and end-all of the American experience. We will all be free of obligation, pain, responsibility, and any other positive or negative thing soon enough. Instead of the pursuit of freedom, we should dedicate ourselves to obligations that honor ourselves and others. You don't really want "freedom," you want an obligation that…

I came to similar conclusions as the OP a few years ago but called it "flexibility" instead of "freedom".

Or you might call it "the freedom to choose", which I think is quite different from vanilla overarching "freedom"

Re: The real use of money is to buy freedom

#49

Post by Blahah »

officemonkey wrote: post #43

Everybody just loves the word "freedom," like it's some magical super-juice which is the be-all and end-all of the American experience. We will all be free of obligation, pain, responsibility, and any other positive or negative thing soon enough. Instead of the pursuit of freedom, we should dedicate ourselves to obligations that honor ourselves and others. You don't really want "freedom," you want an obligation that…

Once you have had your freedom forcefully removed, maintaining it becomes a major source of happiness.

> You don't really want "freedom," you want an obligation that you're excited about, you want a responsibility you're eager to take on, you want a job you love doing, you want a relationship that resonates with your values.

Absolutely this. "Freedom" encapsulates the state where you are able to pursue those smaller goals without other people or circumstances preventing you. That is something worth seeking. But it's always worth keeping in mind what you want the freedom for.

Re: The real use of money is to buy freedom

#50

Post by hkmurakami »

dsirijus wrote: post #46
Joeboy wrote: post #41

A few years ago, after spending most of my adult life in voluntary-ish poverty I decided to spend a few years earning proper money. By which I mean, significantly more than my first world country's average salary but still peanuts in HN terms. The main differences it's made to me are: 1) I can afford to buy a home, which I expect to remove a large amount of bullshit from my life and makes me feel more secure about my…

I went a similar road (from $50 a month in an underground windowless garage with no utilities whatsoever, to a 200m2 penthouse). I'd put an accent on your point #2 - it really makes a huge difference to just shoot up some money into trivialities and mundane annoyances in your life just to make them magically go away. Because there's so many of them, most cannot afford that. I'd like to add a point though, maybe the m…

Was #6 because of how you dressed, or because you could host events at your new place, or some other factors?

I'm curious since I have some acquaintances who are morbidly afraid of having members of the opposite sex approach them for their substantial wealth. They go out of their way to mask their material status.

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