It seems to me that the fitting thing to be issued here is an apology, not a pardon.
They already did that. http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/technology/8249792.stm
Royal pardon for codebreaker Alan Turing
81–90 of 163 posts
Re: Royal pardon for codebreaker Alan Turing
#82Earlier quoted context omitted.
I think you may have hit on the crux of it. If any stronger repudiation were offered, would that be the government opening itself up to 25000 expensive lawsuits?
I hope so, it should pay, and heavily. If it was my tax pound I'd support this. The minimum amount of harm this discrimination caused is pretty high, and there is little than can be done to correct this. Financial compensation is about the best thing actually possible, so do it while the victims are still alive. The lame option of waiting until 99% of the victims are dead, then offering some kind of pardon is vastly…
"If it was my tax pound I'd support this."
Well that's easy to say when it isn't. It is my tax pound and I don't. I don't support the posthumous pardon at all, and those calling for the posthumous knighthood are getting ridiculous.
Everyone recognises the value of Turing's input to both the war effort and greater modern life, but sadly the man took his own life. Arguing over whose fault it was it pointless. Pardoning him now does nothing for him. It won't change the impact of his work and it won't produce the work that we lost because of this. Yes the law in the 1950 by todays standards was an ass, but that was the law at the time and the punishment was the punishment. Yes, through 21st century eyes it is abhorrent and I'm extremely glad that the law has changed and what happened to Turing doesn't happen any more, but... It's time that we move on.
Re: Royal pardon for codebreaker Alan Turing
#83Earlier quoted context omitted.
I hope so, it should pay, and heavily. If it was my tax pound I'd support this. The minimum amount of harm this discrimination caused is pretty high, and there is little than can be done to correct this. Financial compensation is about the best thing actually possible, so do it while the victims are still alive. The lame option of waiting until 99% of the victims are dead, then offering some kind of pardon is vastly…
"If it was my tax pound I'd support this." Well that's easy to say when it isn't. It is my tax pound and I don't. I don't support the posthumous pardon at all, and those calling for the posthumous knighthood are getting ridiculous. Everyone recognises the value of Turing's input to both the war effort and greater modern life, but sadly the man took his own life. Arguing over whose fault it was it pointless. Pardoning…
I agree that the goal is moving on. However, I don't think the best way to bridge is to fail to acknowledge our history.
To me, it's important for a society to explicitly acknowledge mistakes.
FWIW, I'm American, and I wish that our government would formally acknowledge people who have clearly been affected by less than fortuitous circumstances.
Re: Royal pardon for codebreaker Alan Turing
#84They should give a royal apology
Re: Royal pardon for codebreaker Alan Turing
#85Pardon ? For what? Thanks but no thanks.
they should give an apology
Re: Royal pardon for codebreaker Alan Turing
#86Re: Royal pardon for codebreaker Alan Turing
#87Re: Royal pardon for codebreaker Alan Turing
#88Earlier quoted context omitted.
I hope so, it should pay, and heavily. If it was my tax pound I'd support this. The minimum amount of harm this discrimination caused is pretty high, and there is little than can be done to correct this. Financial compensation is about the best thing actually possible, so do it while the victims are still alive. The lame option of waiting until 99% of the victims are dead, then offering some kind of pardon is vastly…
"If it was my tax pound I'd support this." Well that's easy to say when it isn't. It is my tax pound and I don't. I don't support the posthumous pardon at all, and those calling for the posthumous knighthood are getting ridiculous. Everyone recognises the value of Turing's input to both the war effort and greater modern life, but sadly the man took his own life. Arguing over whose fault it was it pointless. Pardoning…
Are there abused or disenfranchised groups you do support payments being made to as a form of compensation? Paying out clearly does nothing for Turing, I mean that payment to those still alive could be helpful. For example, the New Zealand government has paid out groups that suffered due to government action like land unfairly taken. I fully support this.
Re: Royal pardon for codebreaker Alan Turing
#89Yes, they apologized 5 years ago, and now there's a pardon. As an important abolitionist from my country once wrote, "Justice that is late is not justice".
Re: Royal pardon for codebreaker Alan Turing
#90Earlier quoted context omitted.
So much this. It drives me nuts that the narrative on this issue always seems to boil down to the idea that Turing somehow earned not being persecuted for being gay through his efforts in the war and the injustice was that the government didn't live up to its end of the bargain, not the fact that he and many others were driven to suicide or horrible lives by this terrible law.
It's symbolic. The pardon does absolutely zero for Turing himself - he's long gone. It's symbolic that society is progressing and saying "we don't agree with this thing we used to do".
It doesn't even do that, pardon is more like forgiveness: "We forgive you for what you've done". And I don't think that's the same as admitting that law was bad.