Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Saab wins Brazil jets deal after NSA spying sours Boeing bid

reuters.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

11–20 of 144 posts

Re: Saab wins Brazil jets deal after NSA spying sours Boeing bid

#11

Post by fiatmoney »

rosser wrote: post #7
_djo_ wrote: post #5

Claiming that the NSA scandal is the primary reason for the Saab win is an overly US-centric view. While there's evidence that Boeing's chances were hurt by the NSA revelations, it's not true that Boeing was a clear favourite. Both Saab and Dassault had presented strong bids and were considered serious contenders, particularly as both offered much higher industrial participation and technology sharing than Boeing and…

Claiming that the NSA scandal is the primary reason for the Saab win is an overly US-centric view. From TFA: "Until earlier this year, Boeing's F/A-18 Super Hornet had been considered the front runner... "The NSA problem ruined it for the Americans," a Brazilian government source said on condition of anonymity." Does it remain a "US-centric view" when Brazil is the party saying, "Because NSA"?

Even if the NSA's spying program ended up not affecting the outcome of the fighter decision, it can still be worthwhile to claim that it did if they have an independent goal of reducing that program.

Re: Saab wins Brazil jets deal after NSA spying sours Boeing bid

#12

Post by kawera »

msantos wrote: post #8

The French bid was turned down by the President herself after major set backs in the current France-Brazil partnership building a nuclear submarine for the Brazilian Navy. Not mentioned here is the fact that old conspiracy theories surrounding the explosion that destroyed the Alcantara launch pad and killed the cream of the crop of the Brazilian space program, have recently been resurrected and it's believed plausibl…

Care to cite your sources? (en/fr/pt)

Re: Saab wins Brazil jets deal after NSA spying sours Boeing bid

#13

Post by msantos »

_djo_ wrote: post #5

Claiming that the NSA scandal is the primary reason for the Saab win is an overly US-centric view. While there's evidence that Boeing's chances were hurt by the NSA revelations, it's not true that Boeing was a clear favourite. Both Saab and Dassault had presented strong bids and were considered serious contenders, particularly as both offered much higher industrial participation and technology sharing than Boeing and…

Surely not "because NSA" entirely.

It could also be because the USA has stopped a big sale from Embraer to Venezuela years ago.

And earlier this year the USA annulled a contract that Embraer had won to supply Super Tucano to the US Air force in favour of a local plane maker.

EDIT: http://www.forbes.com/sites/kenrapoza/2013/03/15/u-s-air-for...

Re: Saab wins Brazil jets deal after NSA spying sours Boeing bid

#15

Post by zorked »

msantos wrote: post #8

The French bid was turned down by the President herself after major set backs in the current France-Brazil partnership building a nuclear submarine for the Brazilian Navy. Not mentioned here is the fact that old conspiracy theories surrounding the explosion that destroyed the Alcantara launch pad and killed the cream of the crop of the Brazilian space program, have recently been resurrected and it's believed plausibl…

ABIN can't arrest people.

Re: Saab wins Brazil jets deal after NSA spying sours Boeing bid

#16

Post by cylinder »

_djo_ wrote: post #5

Claiming that the NSA scandal is the primary reason for the Saab win is an overly US-centric view. While there's evidence that Boeing's chances were hurt by the NSA revelations, it's not true that Boeing was a clear favourite. Both Saab and Dassault had presented strong bids and were considered serious contenders, particularly as both offered much higher industrial participation and technology sharing than Boeing and…

People need to realize that companies like Boeing, GE, etc. are hardly even viewed as "American" overseas. We (Americans) like to think they are, but these companies are decidedly multinational with huge operations in many, many countries that employ thousands. They also make lots, if not the majority, of their revenue in non-US markets. Their headquarters may be in the US (not always), but they could easily migrate elsewhere, and would, if it were in the best interests of the corporation. In fact, as the rest of the world develops and grows economically and the US becomes a smaller share of the global pie, many may choose to abandon the US market if it's no longer worth the hassle should an oppressive regulatory scheme develop.

Re: Saab wins Brazil jets deal after NSA spying sours Boeing bid

#18

Post by msantos »

zorked wrote: post #15
msantos wrote: post #8

The French bid was turned down by the President herself after major set backs in the current France-Brazil partnership building a nuclear submarine for the Brazilian Navy. Not mentioned here is the fact that old conspiracy theories surrounding the explosion that destroyed the Alcantara launch pad and killed the cream of the crop of the Brazilian space program, have recently been resurrected and it's believed plausibl…

ABIN can't arrest people.

Yes it can, I know that for a fact. It doesn't normally do it because it would blow the agents covers and so they rely on "Policia Federal" to carry out arrests.

Re: Saab wins Brazil jets deal after NSA spying sours Boeing bid

#19

Post by vilda »

_djo_ wrote: post #5

Claiming that the NSA scandal is the primary reason for the Saab win is an overly US-centric view. While there's evidence that Boeing's chances were hurt by the NSA revelations, it's not true that Boeing was a clear favourite. Both Saab and Dassault had presented strong bids and were considered serious contenders, particularly as both offered much higher industrial participation and technology sharing than Boeing and…

It might not be NSA itself, but learning that US is willing to implement backdoors in their interest is a big deal - especially in defense industry. You either have the trust or you don't.

Re: Saab wins Brazil jets deal after NSA spying sours Boeing bid

#20

Post by tobltobs »

cylinder wrote: post #16
_djo_ wrote: post #5

Claiming that the NSA scandal is the primary reason for the Saab win is an overly US-centric view. While there's evidence that Boeing's chances were hurt by the NSA revelations, it's not true that Boeing was a clear favourite. Both Saab and Dassault had presented strong bids and were considered serious contenders, particularly as both offered much higher industrial participation and technology sharing than Boeing and…

People need to realize that companies like Boeing, GE, etc. are hardly even viewed as "American" overseas. We (Americans) like to think they are, but these companies are decidedly multinational with huge operations in many, many countries that employ thousands. They also make lots, if not the majority, of their revenue in non-US markets. Their headquarters may be in the US (not always), but they could easily migrate…

There are only a few companies which are viewed as more "American" than Boeing or GE. MacDonalds and CocaCola maybe.
Post reply on HN