How to get a job after you've been rejected • Hacker News Board

Re: How to get a job after you've been rejected

#31

Post by Morgawr » Tue, Dec 17, 2013, 9:06 PM UTC

mbesto wrote: post #26

> By rejecting me at first, college admissions taught me the most valuable lesson of my life. It doesn’t matter if you’re told no. Everything’s negotiable. I've learned to appreciate this over the years. However, I think this is very much an American thing . I lived for 4 years in Europe and people are much more willing to bend the rules in America, whereas people in Europe tend to "follow the rules". And thus, the p…

As an Italian, I don't agree. But that's for Italy, we're corrupt and we always bend rules.

Currently living in The Netherlands and things are very different here. Also Belgians and Germans are very strict, from what I heard.

Europe in itself is far too broad. We may be very small land-wise but culturally-wise we can be very different between each other. Can't say for sure, really.

Re: How to get a job after you've been rejected

#32

Post by theseoafs » Tue, Dec 17, 2013, 9:07 PM UTC

bonemachine wrote: post #6

So I put in my 100 hours. I made a custom resume that I illustrated with little Evernote-style animals. I got out my guitar and sang a song about why I wanted to work there. I designed a custom iPhone app for them. Eww. Talk about trying way too hard.

That part definitely put me off too, but I wouldn't chalk it up to "trying too hard". I have a problem with the author's idea that putting "extra work" into a resume with animals on it actually made her a better candidate for the job in any way. It's worded as if she's surprised the song she recorded failed to actually demonstrate her competency to the hiring manager any better. Of course it didn't. No one hires software developers based on the colorfulness of their resumes or their vocal range.

Re: How to get a job after you've been rejected

#33

Post by Sheepshow » Tue, Dec 17, 2013, 9:08 PM UTC

groby_b wrote: post #29

I'm going to state an uncomfortable truth. As somebody who has seen more than a few horrible interview failures - how about you put in a 100 hours of work before you come to the interview? Not for the company, but for yourself. And not doing fancy resumes with songs and pictures, but learning the basics of what you're actually doing? Because I'm fairly certain that most interview rejections are due to the fact that y…

Couldn't agree more. I've seen a few "job applications" that are more like marriage proposals, and its sickening.

Hey actually that gives me a great idea: maybe I should spend 100 hours preparing a marriage proposal for that college girlfriend who dumped me.

Re: How to get a job after you've been rejected

#34

Post by jowiar » Tue, Dec 17, 2013, 9:10 PM UTC

groby_b wrote: post #29

I'm going to state an uncomfortable truth. As somebody who has seen more than a few horrible interview failures - how about you put in a 100 hours of work before you come to the interview? Not for the company, but for yourself. And not doing fancy resumes with songs and pictures, but learning the basics of what you're actually doing? Because I'm fairly certain that most interview rejections are due to the fact that y…

I see far more failure by way of deeming oneself unqualified and not applying than I do by way of train wreck interviews.

For me, job applications are like college applications - the best attitude is not to get my heart committed to anything outside my control, and not to take anything as a statement about who I am, and always will be, but rather on what, at a particular point in time, I can offer a particular person. I've had my ass handed to me in an interview before - It was a great experience - I learned what I needed to get better at to get the type of position I wanted, and through applications, failures, and learning, I eventually found a great position.

Re: How to get a job after you've been rejected

#35

Post by bonemachine » Tue, Dec 17, 2013, 9:21 PM UTC

null_ptr wrote: post #19

stevenp wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Seriously? It's not trying too hard at all. If there's a job you really want and you're really passionate about getting it no matter what, you should do anything in your power to try to get it. If you fail, you can at least say that you tried as hard as you could and it just didn't work out.

If you're worth anything you don't need to break into song to get them to hire you. Your time would be better spent honing your skills and looking toward new opportunities. Workers have the right to dignity just like everybody else.

Exactly -- "breaking into a song" doesn't seem to convey anything other than a palpable lack of confidence.

Re: How to get a job after you've been rejected

#36

Post by djhworld » Tue, Dec 17, 2013, 9:33 PM UTC

bicknergseng wrote: post #16

karenxcheng wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Lots of people have spent more than 100 hours on their job search, spread across hundreds of companies. The idea is - what if you focused on the ones you really want, and put more effort into those?

I'd wager this is ~90% of the problem with the modern day employment market. Monster et al made it too easy to apply for a job. Now every position gets 1000 applicants and every applicant applies for 100 jobs. The applicant thinks the more they apply, the better their chances. The employer thinks there is a cookie cutter, definition employee out there that will fit 110%, be overqualified, and willing to work for less…

Monster and other job listing sites are mostly just recruitment agency spam trying to get someone to bite. Well at least in the IT industry anyway.

Actually that's probably the symptom of what you're describing, companies no longer manage recruitment internally anymore, instead throwing the responsibility to the hyenas snapping below and hoping they can buffer out most of the shit

Re: How to get a job after you've been rejected

#37

Post by djhworld » Tue, Dec 17, 2013, 9:34 PM UTC

Sheepshow wrote: post #33

groby_b wrote: post #29

I'm going to state an uncomfortable truth. As somebody who has seen more than a few horrible interview failures - how about you put in a 100 hours of work before you come to the interview? Not for the company, but for yourself. And not doing fancy resumes with songs and pictures, but learning the basics of what you're actually doing? Because I'm fairly certain that most interview rejections are due to the fact that y…

Couldn't agree more. I've seen a few "job applications" that are more like marriage proposals, and its sickening. Hey actually that gives me a great idea: maybe I should spend 100 hours preparing a marriage proposal for that college girlfriend who dumped me.

You read them though right? The point of these wild and zany applications is they stand out from the crowd. Visually anyway, the actual content and truth behind it often leaves a lot to be desired, but if you're going in for a marketing job...

Re: How to get a job after you've been rejected

#38

Post by zeidrich » Tue, Dec 17, 2013, 9:42 PM UTC

bonemachine wrote: post #30

pedalpete wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is nothing wrong with working hard to get their attention. It isn't a 2-way street until you've already proven yourself, that's when the relationship become symbiotic. The dating analogies don't apply.

The point is that as with dating, there's a penalty (in some cases fatal) that comes with trying too hard -- you just come off as cloying and desperate. The OP clearly exceeded that threshold, by leaps and bounds.

Assuming you put a decent effort into the process prior to applying:

The point is, at this point you've already been told no. The worst case scenario is that you're told "Still no."

Depending on what it is you do to impress them, that can be used in other scenarios. You make some marketing plan or a brochure or redo a website? Stick it in your back pocket and save it again for later.

So you look desperate? So what? Either they say no, in which case apart from the extra work you've done, you're no further behind, or they say yes and think you're desperate, but you have the job.

Re: How to get a job after you've been rejected

#39

Post by rfnslyr » Tue, Dec 17, 2013, 9:48 PM UTC

stevenp wrote: post #12

bonemachine wrote: post #6

So I put in my 100 hours. I made a custom resume that I illustrated with little Evernote-style animals. I got out my guitar and sang a song about why I wanted to work there. I designed a custom iPhone app for them. Eww. Talk about trying way too hard.

Seriously? It's not trying too hard at all. If there's a job you really want and you're really passionate about getting it no matter what, you should do anything in your power to try to get it. If you fail, you can at least say that you tried as hard as you could and it just didn't work out.

How about instead of making pointless songs and trying to appear cute, have your expertise speak for you?

100 hours on shit not related to the job, yikes.

Re: How to get a job after you've been rejected

#40

Post by yaddayadda » Tue, Dec 17, 2013, 9:52 PM UTC

karenxcheng wrote: post #9

probablyfiction wrote: post #5

Job searching must be a nightmare if every application requires 100 hours of effort.

Lots of people have spent more than 100 hours on their job search, spread across hundreds of companies. The idea is - what if you focused on the ones you really want, and put more effort into those?

While on unemployment, people are often required to spread their search across hundreds of companies.

After being laid off, I was unemployed for several months and was required to submit at least 3 applications a week. On the face, that doesn't sound like many, and for some fields it probably isn't heard. But if you're in a specialized field, even finding 3 open positions to apply for becomes a full-time job. And each of those openings tended to require many hours of specialized work. Some of that time was moving a nicely developed resume into their proprietary applicant webpage (urgh!!!). There was one job that actually required me to develop a dummy website. Because I knew there were weeks when I wouldn't even be able to find 3 openings, when I found more than 3 I would intentionally wait until the following week to apply to the more promising openings. The idea being that I could do the minimum work on the required 3 applications, then spend the rest of the week diligently working on the more promising openings, and submit it first thing the following week.

Then there are the weeks that I couldn't even find 3 in my field and didn't have any left over from the previous week. For those I applied to complete throw-away positions. I felt sorry for whatever sap had to review my application.

All the while, I wish I had been able to focus on a handful of desirable positions and personal retraining. Instead, I spent months doing B.S. work just to be able to pay the mortgage until I was able to get a job, which ended up coming through a personal connection and would never have shown up on the radar that the unemployment office required me to use!