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The Selling of Attention Deficit Disorder

nytimes.com

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Re: The Selling of Attention Deficit Disorder

#81

Post by modfodder »

Cthulhu_ wrote: post #58
modfodder wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have a similar history to yours (except GenX not millenial). I've built a decent career for myself, but have always struggled with SAD and bipolar symptoms. When I feel good I'm sure it's something I can control, but as soon as it sneaks up, my life goes into self-destruction mode. I always feel bad about complaining about the effect this has on my life as my income is typically in the top 10% in the U.S., but stil…

I'm no psychologist, but part of what I'm reading here is guilt and pressure about your 'potential'. Trying to pursue that potential and whatnot will probably only make your problems worse or equal. It's not a bad thing to aim a bit lower and just find balance in things.

I hear what your saying, and I've done some of that thru the years. But it goes beyond just lowering expectations, I'm already pretty chill about whatever life brings my way. It has more to do with bouts of depression that have regularly slowed and occasionally sidelined my ambitions as well as an additional stressor on family and relationships.

Re: The Selling of Attention Deficit Disorder

#82

Post by rch »

Shinkei wrote: post #62
invalidOrTaken wrote: post #3

I don't know. I just don't know. I earned a perfect score on the SAT and was voted "Class Genius" in the yearbook, but barely graduated from high school. I was dismissed from university. I went to work for a machine learning company, where we (self included!) did some really neat stuff, including some heroic pre-sales-meeting coding that saved the day in a minor way. But I was fired six months in for low productivity…

This is an honest post, thanks for sharing. I am confused by something though. I have only (to my knowledge) known one person that got a perfect score on the SAT. The reason is that it requires both reasoning as well as 'stamp collecting'--(i.e. book knowledge). If you didn't bother to learn all the obscure vocabulary words used on the SAT that most high schoolers don't know--(extol, capricious, etc.)--then you must'…

I've known plenty of genuinely earnest, hard working people who really know how to put the time in. I'd rather work with people who can hit the high notes, as the saying goes.

Re: The Selling of Attention Deficit Disorder

#83

Post by trendoid »

Houshalter wrote: post #63
maratd wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Here's a brilliant idea—help a person by framing their issues as personal and moral failures. That's sure to be a positive catalyst for change. You're being sarcastic, but it actually IS. We live in a culture where everything is a disorder. How convenient, that all of your failures can be blamed on something you don't control. Here's an idea. Everything you don't take responsibility for. Everything you don't see as…

This is very relevant: http://lesswrong.com/lw/2as/diseased_thinking_dissolving_que... >If something is a real disease, the patient deserves our sympathy and support; for example, cancer sufferers must universally be described as "brave". If it is not a real disease, people are more likely to get our condemnation; for example Sandy's husband who calls her a "pig" for her inability to control her eating habits. The di…

Thanks for this, appreciate the summary. Made me go have a look at the full article.

Re: The Selling of Attention Deficit Disorder

#84

Post by jasonlotito »

maratd wrote: post #68
invalidOrTaken wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I want to engage with this comment because it's one commonly encountered with this sort of thing. >Oh please, enough with the drama. I've led the same life. So has everyone else here. It is precisely my tiring of drama that's led me to my present attitude. Please note that this was a response to an article someone else posted, not a please-pay-attention-to-me self-post. I never talk about this sort of thing in person…

> Candidly, this strikes me as relatively irresponsible advice, and half-humblebrag. "I just get so bored with normal corporate work, you know? I always need something new." Wouldn't know, I've never done corporate work. Merely commenting that I myself frequently get tired of doing the same thing after a month or two, to the point where things simply don't get done. Hence the recommendation for short-term projects. >…

Your comments reek of ignorance and stupidity. Your comment and attitude are harmful, and in no way helpful. Practically every sentence is either just outright wrong, or worse, so completely wrong that anyone taking it to have any merit will be harmed by believing it.

Re: The Selling of Attention Deficit Disorder

#85

Post by jasonlotito »

maratd wrote: post #26
duaneb wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Here's a brilliant idea—help a person by framing their issues as personal and moral failures. That's sure to be a positive catalyst for change. EDIT: For some reason I can't respond to the comment below. My point was, it's easy to frame problems with terms like "weak", "irresponsible", and "lazy". It's hard to actually attempt to communicate, identify a problem in a way that you can talk about the same thing, and fin…

> Here's a brilliant idea—help a person by framing their issues as personal and moral failures. That's sure to be a positive catalyst for change. You're being sarcastic, but it actually IS. We live in a culture where everything is a disorder. How convenient, that all of your failures can be blamed on something you don't control. Here's an idea. Everything you don't take responsibility for. Everything you don't see as…

What are your credentials? Otherwise, your just a worthless blowhard intent on causing harm.

Re: The Selling of Attention Deficit Disorder

#86

Post by dschiptsov »

How come that children in, say India have survived without any medication or even diagnostic of A.D.H.D?)

The answer is, probably, in that the environment and conditioning has a much more to do with these dynamics than medication, so in a less stressed and more friendly environment (which Hindu/Buddhist communities traditionally have) such "disorders" are "self-corrected" by some natural behavioral "therapy", and, perhaps, much less frequently developed in the first place.

In contrast, in social shitholes like Russia number of so-called "problem children" is uncounted, and traditionally the traits described in DSM for a full spectrum of so-called "disorders" are considered quite normal. It is very common scene in Russia when a kid cries "hysterically" non-stop, while parents just scream back or and hit them. This is not exactly A.D.H.D case, but an illustration of what environment does.)

hint: before down-voting try to estimate the population of Hindu and Buddhist countries, which accounts, roughly, to a half of the population of the globe, compared to 300MM of Americans.))

Re: The Selling of Attention Deficit Disorder

#87

Post by jasonlotito »

harvestmoon wrote: post #15

ADHD is overdiagnosed and is often used as a catch all solution for boys being boys. Our school system simply does not approve of kids having energy, being a bit aggressive and playful. That said, as an author, I have focused on adult ADHD. In adults, it is often overlooked, and is estimated at around 4.4% prevalence ratio (the reasonable figures I've seen range from 4-5%.) Treatment of ADHD can be lifechanging and a…

> Treatment of ADHD can be lifechanging and allow someone to succeed where they were struggling and suffering before.

This. 1000 times this. At 33, I didn't think I could just now be diagnosed for ADHD. Low and behold, I have ADHD and OCD. Being able to get help for both...

Yeah, life changing is a good way to describe it.

You mention you are an author focused on adult ADHD. If you ever want to talk, I'm more than happy to share. If I can help one other person like me, it would make all the struggle worth while.

Re: The Selling of Attention Deficit Disorder

#88

Post by onedev »

RankingMember wrote: post #55

I've been on adderall for awhile, and while it has had a marked positive effect on my ability to focus (which has been life changing), the negative side effects suck. I've looked into DIY biofeedback setups, and look forward to the day cheap off-the-shelf biofeedback setups become available for treating ADHD.

I fucking hate that it destroys appetite as well as sleep schedules. It turns you into a zombie, it's terrible.

Re: The Selling of Attention Deficit Disorder

#89

Post by DanBC »

crusso wrote: post #25
DanBC wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It would be great if we could experiment upon you. Every three months we'd start you on a new regime of pills. You wouldn't know if they were meds or placebo. The people giving them to you wouldn't know either. The people writing the report wouldn't know, until after they'd written the report. Obviously we can't do this. But I dearly love to know what the results would be. For what it's worth: I suspect you would tel…

While I applaud applications of the Scientific Method, you write as though you have some doubt that the effects are real. I took Vyvanse for a couple of months to try to help my concentration... holy cow. When it took effect 40 minutes after taking it, I felt like a jackhammer. It was no slight effect that you could dismiss as placebo, my blood pressure went up and I was on task for ten hours of the day, no problem.…

> you write as though you have some doubt that the effects are real.

I'm sure that for some people there is ADD, and that the meds are an important part of being able to function.

Re: The Selling of Attention Deficit Disorder

#90

Post by overgryphon »

negativity wrote: post #22
tibbon wrote: post #19

As a person with ADHD, that article was too long to hold my attention (no, I'm not making a joke here). Also, as a person with ADHD who takes Adderall I don't see what the big fuss about it as a drug/medicine is. It works. I don't (personally) note any side effects, and don't see any reason that I'd stop taking it. Before taking Adderall I was essentially self-medicating my ADHD with copious amounts of coffee on a da…

I think it's exactly the same thing as coffee, and it's not a medical condition at all. Coding really IS naturally boring and mind numbing. That's neither your imagination nor subjective experience. No one ever steps through a series of break-points in a debugger, or skims through 1,000 lines of log output, and thinks: "YEAH, MAN! THIS IS REALLY LIVING!" It pretty much requires an altered state to enjoy this stuff. I…

Not being able to focus is quite a bit different from simply being bored.

Distractions are a problem not only because of the sheer number of them, but because you don't really notice you aren't on task anymore. It can take 30 minutes to realize that reading about ancient Mongolia has nothing to do with that paper you were reading, and another five minutes to trace exactly how you got there. And then you need to find where you were and start again.

Focus is incredibly complex, and not well understood. I don't know where the line is between problem and "lazy", but I do know that will power isn't the whole answer to these types of problems.

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