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Some things to do (and not do) if you aren't invited to interview with YC

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Re: Some things to do (and not do) if you aren't invited to interview with YC

#21

Post by adrianwaj »

pg wrote: post #8

Another thing I'd ask people not to do is write to us asking for the details of why they weren't invited. We explain in the YC FAQ that we won't, but every cycle people deluge us with emails anyway. It's not because we're being secretive that we don't answer these emails. The reason is that there generally are no details to give. Usually when we don't invite a group for interviews, it's not because there was some gla…

This 'rejection without a stated reason' is common practice - and poor practice wherever it may be found, ie recruitment, vc, men/women relationships, record companies and many places else.

The ease by which even minimal feedback can be given which can lead to great benefit to the recipient is obvious, and therefore should be embraced. There may be risks that the recipient makes some kind of rebuttal and wastes time, the reasoning itself behind the rejection causes bad publicity or the feedback process takes time however the benefits to the [in this case YC] ecosystem I think outweigh the disadvantages.

Re: Some things to do (and not do) if you aren't invited to interview with YC

#22

Post by SwellJoe »

gibsonf1 wrote: post #20
pg wrote: post #8

Another thing I'd ask people not to do is write to us asking for the details of why they weren't invited. We explain in the YC FAQ that we won't, but every cycle people deluge us with emails anyway. It's not because we're being secretive that we don't answer these emails. The reason is that there generally are no details to give. Usually when we don't invite a group for interviews, it's not because there was some gla…

PG: If you read through an application where nothing "jumped out", but the team had a fully functional web app to look at and the idea was interesting, would you ignore the web app?

I'm not entirely sure they look at referenced URLs. They were seemingly entirely taken by surprise that we were launched and had paying customers when we arrived in Boston for the interview and had a demo to show. (But, maybe they'd just forgotten, based on the fact that they'd seen 300-400 applications, and probably at least half as many websites.)

Which brings up the advice I've given to folks that I've talked to about getting to the interview: Demo early. We only had a couple of minutes to demo, after running through everyone's questions...and it was almost certainly only on the strength of the demo that we got the yes.

Re: Some things to do (and not do) if you aren't invited to interview with YC

#23

Post by yters »

nostrademons wrote: post #14
yarek wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This reminds me of the application process to Yale. To get int you've got to be really good -- top of your class, top of the district. But, that's not enough - lots of people of that caliber apply. You've got to have something about your application that makes you stand out, that makes you special. You will simply stick in the recruiter's mind. And in this case, stickiness is good. It's the same thing when you're cre…

Amherst does the same thing. However, Amherst's Dean of Admission then recites all the little factoids that stuck out at the regional receptions for admitted students. (This is always lampooned - hilariously - at the RC show, where upperclassmen put their own spin on it for incoming freshmen.) One of the factoids taken from my application was "One student took 8 AP tests, scoring 5s on 5 of them, without ever having…

Whoa, I checked out their website and it looks to be a pretty sweet school. I was homeschooled for a significant portion of my life, and I really liked the open endedness of it all. That's when I was truly motivated to learn for its own sake. I read voraciously and taught myself to program so as to make games. Then I started going to public school where they happened to not like new Americans much:P Anyways, here's hoping that model of education catches on much more widely.

Re: Some things to do (and not do) if you aren't invited to interview with YC

#24

Post by rkabir »

Before you hear back, you could do what we did - assume you got rejected.

What would you do today if you knew you were rejected already?

Hint: for bonus points, assume that YC is out to get you, and gives your brilliant idea[s] to some other shmucks.

Strap down and build. Don't get bogged down in details.

Re: Some things to do (and not do) if you aren't invited to interview with YC

#25

Post by adrianwaj »

andreyf wrote: post #19
zandorg wrote: post #13

When I was rejected in November 2006, I sent a sarcastic (but not rude) email complaining about not being given a reason. However, I doubt anyone was offended. Anyway, I won't be doing that again.

I felt a little disappointed also, but Paul's point above makes sense: The reason is that there generally are no details to give. Usually when we don't invite a group for interviews, it's not because there was some glaring flaw in the application, but simply because nothing in it jumped out at us.

I would expect that in a more perfect world PG (or an equivalent) would also say "We also like to give feedback and point out the things that would have made us more interested had it been included."

Re: Some things to do (and not do) if you aren't invited to interview with YC

#26

Post by boucher »

yters wrote: post #23
nostrademons wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Amherst does the same thing. However, Amherst's Dean of Admission then recites all the little factoids that stuck out at the regional receptions for admitted students. (This is always lampooned - hilariously - at the RC show, where upperclassmen put their own spin on it for incoming freshmen.) One of the factoids taken from my application was "One student took 8 AP tests, scoring 5s on 5 of them, without ever having…

Whoa, I checked out their website and it looks to be a pretty sweet school. I was homeschooled for a significant portion of my life, and I really liked the open endedness of it all. That's when I was truly motivated to learn for its own sake. I read voraciously and taught myself to program so as to make games. Then I started going to public school where they happened to not like new Americans much:P Anyways, here's h…

Amherst generally wavers between being the top ranked, and second ranked, liberal arts college in the country, based on the US News and World Report rankings.

Re: Some things to do (and not do) if you aren't invited to interview with YC

#27

Post by pg »

SwellJoe wrote: post #22
gibsonf1 wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

PG: If you read through an application where nothing "jumped out", but the team had a fully functional web app to look at and the idea was interesting, would you ignore the web app?

I'm not entirely sure they look at referenced URLs. They were seemingly entirely taken by surprise that we were launched and had paying customers when we arrived in Boston for the interview and had a demo to show. (But, maybe they'd just forgotten, based on the fact that they'd seen 300-400 applications, and probably at least half as many websites.) Which brings up the advice I've given to folks that I've talked to a…

I think we knew you were launched when we read your application, but we'd archived that by the time you arrived for the interview.

One of the weird consequences of dealing with very large numbers of startups is that you really can't remember anything except essentials. When the 19 new startups showed up for the first dinner this summer, I probably could have only told you what 3 or 4 of them were doing. The rest had to remind me. (Of course, once the summer gets going, I keep them all loaded in memory all the time.)

Re: Some things to do (and not do) if you aren't invited to interview with YC

#28

Post by pg »

adrianwaj wrote: post #21
pg wrote: post #8

Another thing I'd ask people not to do is write to us asking for the details of why they weren't invited. We explain in the YC FAQ that we won't, but every cycle people deluge us with emails anyway. It's not because we're being secretive that we don't answer these emails. The reason is that there generally are no details to give. Usually when we don't invite a group for interviews, it's not because there was some gla…

This 'rejection without a stated reason' is common practice - and poor practice wherever it may be found, ie recruitment, vc, men/women relationships, record companies and many places else. The ease by which even minimal feedback can be given which can lead to great benefit to the recipient is obvious, and therefore should be embraced. There may be risks that the recipient makes some kind of rebuttal and wastes time,…

poor practice wherever it may be found

Sure you want to commit to that blanket statement? Do you expect every woman in every room you walk into to stop and think about why you didn't draw her attention, and then come and tell you?

Re: Some things to do (and not do) if you aren't invited to interview with YC

#29

Post by andreyf »

adrianwaj wrote: post #25
andreyf wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I felt a little disappointed also, but Paul's point above makes sense: The reason is that there generally are no details to give. Usually when we don't invite a group for interviews, it's not because there was some glaring flaw in the application, but simply because nothing in it jumped out at us.

I would expect that in a more perfect world PG (or an equivalent) would also say "We also like to give feedback and point out the things that would have made us more interested had it been included."

How about: "There was no glaring flaw in your application, but nothing in it jumped out at us. Next time, do something that will impress us more."

Re: Some things to do (and not do) if you aren't invited to interview with YC

#30

Post by DanielBMarkham »

adrianwaj wrote: post #21
pg wrote: post #8

Another thing I'd ask people not to do is write to us asking for the details of why they weren't invited. We explain in the YC FAQ that we won't, but every cycle people deluge us with emails anyway. It's not because we're being secretive that we don't answer these emails. The reason is that there generally are no details to give. Usually when we don't invite a group for interviews, it's not because there was some gla…

This 'rejection without a stated reason' is common practice - and poor practice wherever it may be found, ie recruitment, vc, men/women relationships, record companies and many places else. The ease by which even minimal feedback can be given which can lead to great benefit to the recipient is obvious, and therefore should be embraced. There may be risks that the recipient makes some kind of rebuttal and wastes time,…

Not trying to pile on, but I'm curious to what sort of feedback "nothing in there really caught our eye" would engender. A request for YC to look more closely? I mean, at some point these are qualitative measurements. Even if you had absolute knowledge, it wouldn't make things any better. Did the reviewer have a bad burrito for lunch? Is your name Bob and the reviewer unconsciously hates all people named Bob? Was there a great application just before yours, and even though yours might be acceptable, by comparison it didn't look so good? Were you the first ones evaluated (reviewers are notorious for rejecting early applicants)

I exaggerate, of course, but whatever reason you get I can guarantee won't be satisfying. I mean, you can go to the store tomorrow and pick up a huge stack of books on selling, which all boil down to "Sometimes you strike out for no reason at all. Keep trying" In a vain attempt to pump readers for money, some books give you a huge list of reasons for why you can strike out. I'm a firm believer in controlling all those factors you can -- wear the power tie, turn the temperature down in the office, sit in the proper locations in an important meeting, use body language and NLP, show instead of tell, etc. But I've never had a client say "You know Daniel, we really like your work, but gosh, those shoes are just not doing it for us". That kind of thinking is just grasping at straws. It never works that way.

Look at it this way: a couple of years ago I sent a business plan into a local VC group for their paid-evaluation service (pretty good deal for them, huh?). This time, for my $200, I got back a bunch of comments. What did they tell me? That the reviewers were idiots, that's what. And how exactly could I use this information? Except to be bitter, not at all. So not knowing when it's qualitative is a pretty good thing. As for me, I'd rather save my money and get rejected for free.

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