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President Obama calls on every American to learn code

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Re: President Obama calls on every American to learn code

#291

Post by FrojoS »

ilaksh wrote: post #246
grellas wrote: post #217

Speaking as a non-coder, but as one who did minimal things with programming-like higher-level stuff ranging from the old DOS batch files to VBA and some dabbling with SQL, I am curious whether real engineers believe the idea of broad literacy in coding truly would be valuable and, if so, how exactly. I am not speaking as a skeptic, just as one who does not readily see the point and wants to know. Of course, we are in…

Reading, writing, and mathematics have long been considered fundamental skills. Obama is suggesting 'computer science' as now being a new fundamental skill. I would change that to 'programming'. Most people do not question whether math is a fundamental skill. Programming is actually very similar to some types of math work in school, but with a heavy focus on practical problem solving skills using technology. So the q…

Agreed. I went to highschool in Bavaria and we had two programing courses as part of the math curriculum, taught by our math teacher. Turbo Pascal :-)

Re: President Obama calls on every American to learn code

#292

Post by wes-exp »

walshemj wrote: post #283
wes-exp wrote: post #150

It's easy to point to the feel-good topic of education and cry foul when anyone is against it. But here is the reality. America already overproduces scientists and engineers. The whole notion of talent shortages is generally hot air from special interests (in this case, tech companies) who want a cheaper supply of labor and cannot bear the idea that skilled engineers actually cost a lot. A lot of effort is put into t…

But that system rigidly streamed kids at an early age and until recently once on the apprenticeship track it limited your progression.

I have to believe that there is a happy medium somewhere between prematurely categorizing kids and trying to make every single person to learn to code and obtain a 4-year STEM degree.

Re: President Obama calls on every American to learn code

#293

Post by meowface »

rolux wrote: post #247
grellas wrote: post #217

Speaking as a non-coder, but as one who did minimal things with programming-like higher-level stuff ranging from the old DOS batch files to VBA and some dabbling with SQL, I am curious whether real engineers believe the idea of broad literacy in coding truly would be valuable and, if so, how exactly. I am not speaking as a skeptic, just as one who does not readily see the point and wants to know. Of course, we are in…

Just like the "prescribed foreign language course in middle school", a bit of programming practice may widen your horizon, and help demystify these seemingly opaque machines and networks. It's about practice, not "knowledge" per se. Basic tasks, like: I have a folder full of files, how do I get the filenames into a text file or e-mail? Five-liners in high-level languages, the equivalent of asking for directions in a…

I would say a general computer knowledge course would serve people better than trying to learn a programming language they'll probably never use, or want to use. Basic IT, networking, security, and simple scripting would probably serve the general public best.

Re: President Obama calls on every American to learn code

#294

Post by Alex_MJ »

rolux wrote: post #247
grellas wrote: post #217

Speaking as a non-coder, but as one who did minimal things with programming-like higher-level stuff ranging from the old DOS batch files to VBA and some dabbling with SQL, I am curious whether real engineers believe the idea of broad literacy in coding truly would be valuable and, if so, how exactly. I am not speaking as a skeptic, just as one who does not readily see the point and wants to know. Of course, we are in…

Just like the "prescribed foreign language course in middle school", a bit of programming practice may widen your horizon, and help demystify these seemingly opaque machines and networks. It's about practice, not "knowledge" per se. Basic tasks, like: I have a folder full of files, how do I get the filenames into a text file or e-mail? Five-liners in high-level languages, the equivalent of asking for directions in a…

A lot of it is also the mental structures you form, so you understand what a computer can and can't do easily instead of thinking it's all magic.

You may not have the specific chops to write a program to do it, but you know that doing something to (x) files is just a loop with a if thingy inside of it.

I think part of the "learn to code" movement is also hope that currently non-tech-literate people will learn to help themselves. Once you've googled "how do I do this in python" and found answers enough times, you (hopefully) gradually replace "All of this computer stuff is confusing! I need someone to help me with it. My cousin is good with computers. I'll call him." with "I got this shit. What up, google."

Re: President Obama calls on every American to learn code

#296

Post by AbraKdabra »

FrojoS wrote: post #291
ilaksh wrote: post #246

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Reading, writing, and mathematics have long been considered fundamental skills. Obama is suggesting 'computer science' as now being a new fundamental skill. I would change that to 'programming'. Most people do not question whether math is a fundamental skill. Programming is actually very similar to some types of math work in school, but with a heavy focus on practical problem solving skills using technology. So the q…

Agreed. I went to highschool in Bavaria and we had two programing courses as part of the math curriculum, taught by our math teacher. Turbo Pascal :-)

Turbo Pascal man, the MEMORIES!!

Re: President Obama calls on every American to learn code

#297

Post by pjscott »

coryrc wrote: post #290
grellas wrote: post #217

Speaking as a non-coder, but as one who did minimal things with programming-like higher-level stuff ranging from the old DOS batch files to VBA and some dabbling with SQL, I am curious whether real engineers believe the idea of broad literacy in coding truly would be valuable and, if so, how exactly. I am not speaking as a skeptic, just as one who does not readily see the point and wants to know. Of course, we are in…

So many people live in bubble with no connection to the real world; insulated by religious dogma and partisan ignorance. Debating need not concern with actual provable, reliable facts, but soundbites and appeals to authority. But you can't fool the computer. You can beg and plead, you can say your teacher tells you that it should work, but ultimately you can't make it work unless you actually do. You can fake your ch…

This is an equally strong argument for teaching plumbing or woodworking.

Re: President Obama calls on every American to learn code

#298

Post by rhizome »

dinkumthinkum wrote: post #251
potatolicious wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wat. A few months ago when someone taught a homeless man to code we congratulated him on improving another man's lot in life. We continue to give kudos to folks like CodeAcademy for teaching people how to code free of charge and introducing more people to our industry. But when the government does it it's a conspiracy the depress wages? Sometimes I just... nevermind, I forget where I am.

Sh... don't disagree with or poke holes in the echo chamber ...

What echo chamber?

Even better: in what way(s) is/are there not enough coders in America?

Re: President Obama calls on every American to learn code

#299

Post by sanderjd »

L4mppu wrote: post #222
toomuchtodo wrote: post #167

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We should also be teaching how to change a tire, how to cook basic nutritious meals, personal finance, etc.. “A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a compu…

You don't teach kids how to cook or manage their finances? And people wonder why you are so obese and in debt.

Depends on who the "you" here is. Our schools do a mediocre job of teaching those things (especially finances), many families do a great job of it, and many families do a poor job of it.
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