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Reform Government Surveillance

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Re: Reform Government Surveillance

#201

Post by arca_vorago »

Let's cut to the chase: surveillance is a symptom of a larger root issue. These major companies aren't attacking the government surveillance problem out of concern of their users, my guess is that they are getting ready to make a data power-play against the government.

So essentially, the privacy concerns of people are being used as a ball between players, but the people are still going to get kicked around.

Until we address the almost complete corruption of the institutional structures that we consider to be foundational of this country... well, I don't know what's going to happen, but I'm pretty sure it won't be pretty for the serfs ahem I mean citizens.

The checks and balances system is almost non-existent. The executive has power over the other two branches, and the supra-national corporations have power over all three. The justice system is a farce, the SCOTUS are likely compromised, and oversight of intelligence agencies is almost non-existent. Resource wars loom on the horizon, what I call the shadow players like Zbigniew Brzezinski are encouraging a return to the tripolar world, and all this as wealth disparity increases amazingly fast.

Surveillance is not about security, it's about control. The question no one is asking is, "Why?".

Re: Reform Government Surveillance

#202

Post by anoncowherd »

zymhan wrote: post #189
cryoshon wrote: post #183

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The courts and executive branches are always (always, always, always) going to side with the power of the government itself-- this is clearly demonstrated throughout history in every totalitarian government. In our system of government, this situation is guaranteed by the appointment of the ranking members of the judiciary branch by the executive branch. This guarantees loyalty from the judiciary-- loyalty to party l…

You have a fundamental misunderstanding of why the judiciary is the US is setup the way it is. Judges are appointed by the Executive, but they are essentially immune from any political pressure after they're appointed, as they don't have to get re-elected or re-appointed. The courts do not always side with the power of government, as has been shown multiple times (e.g. recently barring the FBI from throwing GPS track…

>> You need to try harder if you want to convince people their government and their freedom is a lie.

Where did this idea come from? :p .. You're on to something, by the way. It's almost as if you were already kind of convinced yourself.

Re: Reform Government Surveillance

#203

Post by chestnut-tree »

pacala wrote: post #15

This is getting ridiculous. The ad empires built on stalking every single breath of every single human want to take governments to task on the topic of stalking. What about cleaning up your own house first? 1. Limiting Corporations’ Authority to Collect Users’ Information Corporations should codify sensible limitations on their ability to collect and disclose user data that balance their need for the data in limited…

I agree - there's something a tad hypocritical about companies like Google and Facebook who voraciously track and record as much online browsing behaviour as they possibly can. Where is the transparency from these companies on what they record and track? Just go and read Google's privacy policies - so vaguely worded, they tell you nothing about what they track and record.

Google, in particular has it's digital fingerprints all over the web. Its' online reach is far greater than any other company. They even have an entire OS that potentially tracks your every action. Sure, they are not using the data they collect for nefarious purposes, but that doesn't mean they shouldn't be subject to much greater scrutiny.

Just look at the quote from Larry Page on the website:

"The security of users' data is critical..."

It's not just about security, but about privacy too. Privacy and security are related but separate issues. You can have the best security in the world and continue to voraciously gobble every byte of data you can possibly capture. I don't doubt Google's commitment to security matters. But can you trust them on matters of privacy?

Re: Reform Government Surveillance

#205

Post by samstave »

pg wrote: post #19

Among other things, this is the tipping point for how Snowden will be viewed. If all these powerful companies agree, in an unprecedented show of unanimity, that this is an important problem, then Snowden is ipso facto a hero for bringing it to our attention. The curious thing is, I feel the linkage works in the other direction too. If Snowden had been caught and was now having his brains scrambled by solitary confine…

Curious, PG, how do you personally reconcile Silicon Valley's participation in the Surveillance State? E.G. Palantir's tech, possibly, being core to some of the capabilities - and by extension, VCs such as Peter Thiel's support of such companies...

Its such a complex issue, I think, for this industry; Strive to make incredible technologies, hope they are used for good.

Do you have any thoughts on this?

Re: Reform Government Surveillance

#206

Post by samstave »

veidr wrote: post #132
hooande wrote: post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is nothing more reviled by people who were born during the cold war than a criminal who defects first to china and then to russia. No amount of tech industry pr can facilitate a comeback from that. Almost half of the people in this country will always see Snowden as a traitor. Government surveillance has become a political wedge issue, similar to abortion. No one likes it or encourages it but people have strong…

> There is nothing more reviled by people who were born during the cold war than a criminal who defects first to china and then to russia. I was born during the Cold War and I don't see it that way. In fact, I think you have it precisely backwards. I remember being alive when the USSR and East Germany were going concerns, and those countries seemed so horrible -- the USA really was on what any sane person (by my defi…

I am 39 also, and I have also been following "Conspiracy Theory" topics since the late 80s. I have been aware of, and decrying, this sort of thing for two solid decades now.

The GP's question is predicated on the assumption that people have not been paying attention to the creep toward tyranny that these programs have brought for years... but the fact is that not only have people been paying attention; there has been a decades long effort to shield mainstream awareness of this. Media has been more than just complicit in MISO (PSyOP) activities to marginalize anyone who has been discussing these topics.

Christ, Hollywood has been out-right guilty of running PR for the MIC bastards for 30 years now.

There is a very clear crew responsible for this as well.

The CIA built by GHW Bush and his cabal of war/drug profiteers.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yJDFHd5eEzw

You owe it to yourself to watch that 39 minutes.

Re: Reform Government Surveillance

#207

Post by d0ugie »

You'd think Google, or any of the companies, would host such a thing themselves, rather than sub it out to Godaddy, using a PTR of the domain name relevant to the site -- and, especially in the spirit of things, a properly-configured SSL certificate that doesn't set off warnings, pointing where it ought to (like the IP's PTR), with HSTS and PFS in place and so forth.

What indication is there that this is not a hoax?

Re: Reform Government Surveillance

#208

Post by wavefunction »

joering2 wrote: post #184
DanielBMarkham wrote: post #151

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I came down pretty hard on Manning, but Snowden is a hero. It's one thing to declare war on secrecy itself by dumping everything you can find. It's something else to release narrowly-targeted material solely for the purpose of pointing out to the voters that their government is lying to them. That's heroic in my book.

Manning is a hero, and its okay to down-vote this post.

I upvoted it as I agree.

Re: Reform Government Surveillance

#210

Post by atmosx »

Hm, I wonder why I see no Cisco and Amazon on logos, there. After all the money Cisco is loosing are they still reluctant to go against the USA gov, who knows what kind of contracts were made...
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