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Government Chemist Tampered With 40,000 Cases

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51–60 of 173 posts

Re: Government Chemist Tampered With 40,000 Cases

#51
post #43

What about the prosecutors involved in requesting faked evidence? One would expect some long sentences.

I would expect them never being allowed to be a prosecutor ever again. There's plenty of other legal jobs they can have, but they abused the public's trust too much to ever hold this one ever again.

Re: Government Chemist Tampered With 40,000 Cases

#52
Embarassing for the government, criminal, etc? Yes, but the title (both on HN and in the original) is sensationalistic. 40,000 cases in 10 years? That's around 15 cases per working day. She must have almost done a search and replace to be that 'productive'.

Because of that, I suspect the 'up to 40,000' means there are 40,000 cases that she might have affected, not that she is known to have affected.

Re: Government Chemist Tampered With 40,000 Cases

#53

How hard would it have been to insert a random cross check in to the system? So every 300 tests, the sample is retested by another lab? There's no motivation or incentive whatsoever to structure the process to decrease convictions, that is one of the unspoken but defining features of our legal system. There is an ideal that two sides are arguing something in a neutral setting, but one side is the government, and lite…

Not that hard, but it costs money, and in any case she had evidence to the actual samples and intentionally contaminated them with real drugs.

Re: Government Chemist Tampered With 40,000 Cases

#55
post #48
post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have mixed feelings about jail terms in general, but I agree– this is precisely the sort of crime I would imagine carrying a life sentence. The number of cases affected & lives disrupted here is hardly fathomable.

I don't know how Massachusetts law -- or US Federal law -- swings, but here in the UK there's a specific crime, magnificently called Conspiracy to Pervert the Course of Justice, which covers everything from perjury to faking evidence. And while the average sentence is on the order of 2 years, there's no upper limit: a life sentence is possible in sufficiently extreme cases.

With 40k counts here, it can be a matter of deciding whether the sentences --no matter how light--should be served concurrently or sequentially.

Re: Government Chemist Tampered With 40,000 Cases

#56
post #23

This kind of case is fascinating. The woman wasn't evil. But her actions really are. It's very easy, too easy, to say that she is evil because what she did was so bad. But that's lazy, and it misses the interesting stuff. How do people get caught up in performing such horrendous acts? There's a bunch of cognitive stuff going on, and some subtle manipulation. I suspect that something similar is how we end up with app…

No. It is simpler than you are making it out to be. If you say "I did the test that proves it is heroin" and you didn't, and you are smart enough to be a chemist, and you see some poor guy get put in jail, then you are evil.

Okay, sure, whatever.

But she didn't think she was being evil. She somehow persuaded herself that what she was doing was okay.

That's the interesting bit. Why do people go along with things that they know are wrong. She wasn't alone in this, there are a bunch of other people involved too. And it's similar for other frauds and deceptions.

She didn't wake up and think "Fuck it, I'm going to jail thousands of innocent people". So, what was she thinking?

Can we test for that kind of thinking in other people? How do we protect against is?

Re: Government Chemist Tampered With 40,000 Cases

#57
post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For someone supposedly concerned about human life, you seem awfully eager to end one.

Superficially I have to agree with you that I look like a hypocrite. The government is the body which has a monopoly on violence. In other words, they're the only people who can legally do things to people that nobody would volunteer to have done to them, like going to prison. It's the government's job to provide courts through which disputes can be resolved, since you aren't supposed to take matters into your own ha…

By god, is the human race so savage that we resort to killing so quickly. This is a life, something some people would consider priceless. Not something you can view arithmetically, calculating the hours in damage caused versus somebody's time left.

Re: Government Chemist Tampered With 40,000 Cases

#58
post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For someone supposedly concerned about human life, you seem awfully eager to end one.

Your argument is one of semantics. He is a defender of those who have not deprived others of their right to life. This is the reason why both the word murder and the word kill exist. There is a fundamental difference that you don't appreciate.

Unless there was a death penalty administered due to this, she has not deprived anyone of "life" in the sense suggested. She denied their freedom, and this is a grave injustice, but not one fit for a death penalty. How savage and petty that would be.

Re: Government Chemist Tampered With 40,000 Cases

#59
post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For someone supposedly concerned about human life, you seem awfully eager to end one.

Superficially I have to agree with you that I look like a hypocrite. The government is the body which has a monopoly on violence. In other words, they're the only people who can legally do things to people that nobody would volunteer to have done to them, like going to prison. It's the government's job to provide courts through which disputes can be resolved, since you aren't supposed to take matters into your own ha…

Like many "criminal-friendly" aspects of criminal law, the opposition to the death penalty goes beyond compassion for the guilty; it is motivated by a desire to protect the other innocent from abuse of power, and principled belief that forcibly ending a life is unacceptable because no person is capable and trustworthy to accurately and fairly determining which cases deserve it, and drawing a bright line to separates the kind of criminal people who would kill unnecessarily from the civilized people who would not, and sitting comfortably on our side without engendering doubts.
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