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Is this the most value-dense information on Earth?

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Re: Is this the most value-dense information on Earth?

#21

Post by jere »

>Thus, each individual bit protects USD $631,212... USD $631,212 per bit

That seems a rather flawed way of viewing the density, since that key represents 2^256 possible combinations. So if you take a way a bit, the density by that measure goes up 0.3%. Practically speaking, it should double.

Why don't we instead calculate the density as the expected value of guessing one combination. In other words, let's say I have stolen an ATM card and can wipe a bank account containing $100,000 by guessing the 4 digit pin:

$100,000/(10^4) = $10/guess

Or in our case:

$161,590,330/(2^256) = $1.39e-69/guess

Not so impressive now.

Re: Is this the most value-dense information on Earth?

#22

Post by perfmode »

Tzunamitom wrote: post #19

Depends how you define value... Arguably the knowledge that e=mc^2 is far more valuable, and contained within much less data.

Does secrecy matter?

There was a period in history where this claim was certainly true. Now, not so much.

Information of this nature loses value when revealed.

That private key holds value until it becomes public. Then, the wallet is plundered and its value falls to nought.

Re: Is this the most value-dense information on Earth?

#23

Post by clarkm »

whatshisface wrote: post #2

Considering that anyone trying to sell that much bitcoin at once would pretty much crash the currency, how much is it really worth? Perhaps some kind of revolutionary mathematical fact could be worth even more? This is a very interesting question. EDIT: A lot of people responding to me seem to be trying to contradict my argument by pointing out that if it was true, it would be true for almost everything. I don't get…

That argument proves too much [1]. The same can be said for almost all stock, e.g. Bill Gates could sell of his shares of Microsoft and crash the stock price.

[1] http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Proving_too_much

Re: Is this the most value-dense information on Earth?

#24

Post by rch »

How about peptides? The targeting end of the anti-obesity drug described in [1] can be expressed as 7 characters (KGGRAKD) in a 20 character alphabet. Another agreement [2] values candidate peptides at $32.8M each, even without a specific therapeutic application. The same value could be applied to certain short linear motifs, which could be composed of as few as 3 amino acids. These strings don't suffer from the same liquidity problems that limit the real value of bitcoin addresses either (i.e. the value is really in the data).

[1] http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3666164/

[2] http://www.arrowheadresearch.com/press-releases/arrowhead-an...

Re: Is this the most value-dense information on Earth?

#25

Post by alexeisadeski3 »

downer94 wrote: post #5

Bruce Schneier once equated the security of a 256 bit private key by comparing the energy needed to brute force all possible combinations of 256 bits to the amount of energy harnessed for one year by a Dyson Sphere built around the sun. So maybe there's a correlation, in the sense of knowing the GPS coordinates of Fort Knox, and targeting it with an ICBM?

Isn't the gold at Fort Knox already off the market? Would destroying it really alter the value of existent non-Knox gold that much? How much?

Re: Is this the most value-dense information on Earth?

#27

Post by jsharpe »

jere wrote: post #21

>Thus, each individual bit protects USD $631,212... USD $631,212 per bit That seems a rather flawed way of viewing the density, since that key represents 2^256 possible combinations. So if you take a way a bit, the density by that measure goes up 0.3%. Practically speaking, it should double. Why don't we instead calculate the density as the expected value of guessing one combination. In other words, let's say I have…

I agree that that makes a lot more sense in a way, but there is another interpretation.

Suppose you are omniscient but that you have a terminal illness, and have 256 time units left in your life to give value to your heirs. Due to your illness, you can only communicate by blinking. If you can give one bit of information per time unit by blinking, what is the information you can give your heirs that will maximize their inheritance?

Re: Is this the most value-dense information on Earth?

#28

Post by perfmode »

jsharpe wrote: post #27
jere wrote: post #21

>Thus, each individual bit protects USD $631,212... USD $631,212 per bit That seems a rather flawed way of viewing the density, since that key represents 2^256 possible combinations. So if you take a way a bit, the density by that measure goes up 0.3%. Practically speaking, it should double. Why don't we instead calculate the density as the expected value of guessing one combination. In other words, let's say I have…

I agree that that makes a lot more sense in a way, but there is another interpretation. Suppose you are omniscient but that you have a terminal illness, and have 256 time units left in your life to give value to your heirs. Due to your illness, you can only communicate by blinking. If you can give one bit of information per time unit by blinking, what is the information you can give your heirs that will maximize thei…

This is very clever. I love it.

Re: Is this the most value-dense information on Earth?

#29

Post by chiph »

hrjet wrote: post #26
chiph wrote: post #13

At some point, someone's going to decide it'll be easier to try and crack that key than mine.

Is that true? Can the "difficulty" level in hashing ever reach the bit-length of the key?

Technically, I don't know, as I don't personally understand the code behind the mining and what the difficulty would be like to mine the very last bitcoin.

But from a social aspect, cracking that key would be like hitting one of the multi-state lotteries. And people continue to play them all the time, despite the astronomical odds against their winning.

Re: Is this the most value-dense information on Earth?

#30

Post by thrill »

jsharpe wrote: post #27
jere wrote: post #21

>Thus, each individual bit protects USD $631,212... USD $631,212 per bit That seems a rather flawed way of viewing the density, since that key represents 2^256 possible combinations. So if you take a way a bit, the density by that measure goes up 0.3%. Practically speaking, it should double. Why don't we instead calculate the density as the expected value of guessing one combination. In other words, let's say I have…

I agree that that makes a lot more sense in a way, but there is another interpretation. Suppose you are omniscient but that you have a terminal illness, and have 256 time units left in your life to give value to your heirs. Due to your illness, you can only communicate by blinking. If you can give one bit of information per time unit by blinking, what is the information you can give your heirs that will maximize thei…

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