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Americans don't trust each other anymore

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11–20 of 73 posts

Re: Americans don't trust each other anymore

#11
> "Americans have abandoned their bowling leagues and Elks lodges to stay home and watch TV. Less socializing and fewer community meetings"

Americans have just as many social and community interactions as ever -- but a much higher percentage are semi-broadcasts through social media.

Hanging out with your friends at the bowling league, you might be a little bit cautious about expressing political views, and when there is disagreement it will be set aside by the tenth frame. As a result, people learned to trust each other in spite of disagreement. Online, certain views tend to be broadcast, and when there is disagreement it often turns into a quick unfriending and behind-the-back trash talking about what an intolerant jerk the ex-friend is. As a result, people learn that outsiders are bad people who should never ever be trusted.

Re: Americans don't trust each other anymore

#12
I'll note for other readers of Hacker News who don't know (and thus don't trust) the domain of this submitted article that it is actually a syndicated news story from the Associated Press, and I would have to say that I think the article is well reported. (In other words, I trust the statistics behind the article, which come from the federal government's National Social Survey.)

The article includes some dire warnings about decline of social trust in the United States during the last forty years, and also some ideas about how social trust can increase. "People do get a little more trusting as they age. But beginning with the baby boomers, each generation has started off adulthood less trusting than those who came before them." I daresay it is correct that MOST Americans become more trusting as they age. In my middle age, I feel very comfortable both in the community I live in and as I travel about the United States. (I have been to all of the fifty United States, and to other territories of my country.)

To take the article seriously, and to suggest a possible help that was not suggested in the article, I will propose for your thoughtful discussion (I trust you here on Hacker News) one policy that might help. Let's take care of the economic gap problem mentioned in the article and some other factors that harm social trust by building all of the public school systems in the United States on the foundational principle of family choice. I have seen an example of how this policy could help where I live. Minnesota, where I now live and where I grew up, has had largely equal per-capita funding for public school pupils statewide since the 1970s. That reduces the effect of family income differences on the availability of adequately funded schools. The state law change that made most school funding come from general state appropriations rather than from local property taxes was called the "Minnesota miracle."[1] Today most funding for schools is distributed by the state government on a per-pupil enrollment basis.[2]

The funding reform in the 1970s was followed up by two further reforms in the 1980s. First, the former compulsory instruction statute in Minnesota was ruled unconstitutional in a court case involving a homeschooling family, and a new compulsory instruction statute explicitly allows more nonpublic school alternatives for families who seek those. Second, the Legislature, pushed by the then Governor, set up statewide open enrollment[3] and the opportunity for advanced learners to attend up to two years of college while still high school students on the state's dime.[4] And Minnesota also has the oldest charter school statute in the United States.[5]

Parents in Minnesota now have more power to shop than parents in most states. That gets closer to the ideal of detecting the optimum education environment for each student (by parents observing what works for each of their differing children) and giving it to them by open-enrolling in another school district (my school district has inbound open-enrollment students from forty-one other school districts of residence) or by homeschooling, or by postsecondary study at high school age, or by exercising other choices. And I think that builds social trust by making school communities more nearly communities of choice than communities of compulsion.

The educational results of Minnesota schools are well above the meager results of most United States schools, and almost competitive (but not fully competitive) with the better schools in the newly industrialized countries of east Asia and southeast Asia. And the social trust level in Minnesota seems to be above the United States national average, although I'd have to check the National Social Survey data to be sure about that. A good country to compare in this regard to the United States would be the Netherlands, which by its constitution has had pervasive school choice for the last century.

[1] http://www.mnhs.org/library/tips/history_topics/18public.htm...

[2] http://www.house.leg.state.mn.us/hrd/pubs/mnschfin.pdf

http://education.state.mn.us/MDE/SchSup/SchFin/index.html

[3] http://education.state.mn.us/MDE/StuSuc/EnrollChoice/index.h...

[4] http://education.state.mn.us/MDE/StuSuc/CollReadi/PSEO/index...

[5] http://www.amazon.com/Zero-Chance-Passage-Pioneering-Charter...

Re: Americans don't trust each other anymore

#13
post #8

There has been over a decade of propaganda telling people not to trust each other... all post-9/11 messaging intended to create insecurity in the population.

WW2 had a ton of propaganda about distrusting people, yet according to this article that was a very trusting time.

Re: Americans don't trust each other anymore

#15
post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Probably makes it worse. If you tell people the currency doesn't leave a paper trail then they'll worry about people scamming them or screwing them over in some way, shape, or form.

That point raises, I believe, the question of what exactly is motivating these digital currencies' adoption, assuming that the strongest economic power has a growing rate of social distrust.

Because bitcoin is an algorithmic solution to exactly that problem - trust in a distributed system, casually known as the Byzantine Generals Problem, or Two Generals problem [1].

The innovators and early adopters were motivated by their understanding of the utility in finally achieving a solution to that problem in the context of digital currency (not historically possible for digital currencies till the invention of 1) the Internet and 2) the BitTorrent protocol, so essentially a major breakthrough and first in human history). They provided the critical mass, social proof, and wealth effect that then drove later adoption.

[1]:https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Two_Generals%27_Problem

Re: Americans don't trust each other anymore

#17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That point raises, I believe, the question of what exactly is motivating these digital currencies' adoption, assuming that the strongest economic power has a growing rate of social distrust.

Because bitcoin is an algorithmic solution to exactly that problem - trust in a distributed system, casually known as the Byzantine Generals Problem, or Two Generals problem [1]. The innovators and early adopters were motivated by their understanding of the utility in finally achieving a solution to that problem in the context of digital currency (not historically possible for digital currencies till the invention of…

This!

Re: Americans don't trust each other anymore

#19

I'll note for other readers of Hacker News who don't know (and thus don't trust) the domain of this submitted article that it is actually a syndicated news story from the Associated Press, and I would have to say that I think the article is well reported. (In other words, I trust the statistics behind the article, which come from the federal government's National Social Survey.) The article includes some dire warning…

Thank you for the additional links, but by my tally this article only cites two statistics without bothering to explore how the statistics could be irrelevant to the overall point that the article is making. I find the generalized claim that overall "trust" has declined to be an extremely difficult point to support. I would have appreciated a more thoroughgoing portrait of the point than just two data points and some generalized citations that social scientists "think x".

In my opinion this is a great example of a misuse of statistics. I'm not saying the article's claims are incorrect, but it did a poor job of convincing me of anything.

Re: Americans don't trust each other anymore

#20
In my opinion, decades of corporatist conditioning and manufacturing consent are at least partially responsible for this situation. The corporate mass media has induced distrust in Americans with one another in many ways. One of which is all those articles portraying average Americans as extremely litigious and corrupt with bunk stories on hot McDonald's coffee, etc.

http://boingboing.net/2013/10/21/the-true-story-about-the-wo...

The media focuses much more on crime and how we hurt each other than on the many more cases in which we cooperate and help one another.

In more recent years, corporations and parts of the military-industrial complex have been poisoning Americans against each other via the Internet by astroturfing comment threads, etc. and spreading general fear, uncertainty and doubt with a nice sprinkling of intolerance and hatred.

The mass media glosses over corporate welfare while focusing like a laser on welfare fraud by the poor, etc. They want us to despise each other to gain by the oldest tactic in the book - divide and conquer.

It's been working.

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