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The One in Which I Say Open Source Software Sucks

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Re: The One in Which I Say Open Source Software Sucks

#41

Post by sophacles »

0xdefec8 wrote: post #33

As a dude who just tried Ubuntu for the first time in 5 years to see how far they've come, but couldn't because the fucking liveCD didn't have a driver for my cdrom, this rings true. But for what it's worth, after a few grueling days getting the p.o.s. up and running, I was shocked to have all the UI fluff my macbook has, plus the infinite list of other great stuff that's inherent to Linux. The moral? Just shrinkwrap…

Wait, you're actually saying that:

1. Someone still makes non-standard cd-roms? 2. Someone else still buys them?

After learning you are person #2, why would anyone ever trust any other judgement you make?

Re: The One in Which I Say Open Source Software Sucks

#42

Post by access_denied »

cschwarm wrote: post #38
ori_b wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can also get great usability from a lead developer with taste, and people that are actually interested in using the software. Profit is certainly not the only incentive that drives people. Saving time and effort by fixing problems (usability and otherwise) is also a great motivator.

True. But for Open Source projects, having a lead developer with taste is a matter of chance. And people using the software usually don't care about the "no-users" but only their own wants and needs. In contrast, Closed Source products simply hire a professional interface designer if that's necessary to convince "no-users" to buy.

How many lead devels on OSS projects would bend before a pro UID who would contribute to the project?

Re: The One in Which I Say Open Source Software Sucks

#43

Post by cschwarm »

psadauskas wrote: post #21
bad_user wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Having a central repository that handles version dependencies and upgrades ... is great. But let's be honest here: whenever a newer version of a software package is released, it can take months before it enters sid on Debian, or in Ubuntu, and these are the better-maintained distros. And if you want to distribute proprietary software, maintaining multiple packages for multiple distributions and multiple versions, is…

But that's the philosophy of those distros such as Debian, Ubunutu and Fedora: Don't upgrade anything except security patches between releases. If you want the bleeding edge packages, you need to install it yourself from an add-on repo (once you set it up, its just as easy as `apt-get install newpkg`. Or, pick a rolling-release distro that caters more towards having the latest packages available, such as Gentoo or Ar…

That's just an explanation, not a reason.

Why does it have to be like that? Why does Linux distributions fall in one of two categories: either "stable foundation and out-dated apps" or "unstable foundation and recent apps"?

What many people want is a stable foundation and recent apps. This is easier to get with a decentral installation system.

Re: The One in Which I Say Open Source Software Sucks

#44

Post by rottencupcakes »

naz wrote: post #35

I think the main problem with Open Source application software is the lack of experience in the field the application deals with. Open source programming libraries and languages, webservers and browsers are all great because they are mainly programming problems, and open source developers are programmers. Things like the GIMP and Virtualdub try to deal with problems outside the field of programming, and don't have th…

This is exactly the problem. What percent of graphic designers would use an app, find a bug, and report it, let alone wade through the code and fix it?

On the other hand, an open source webserver or programming language, in which the user is a programmer by default, is much more likely to get fixed.

And honestly, what is your average open source developer more interested in: GIMP or Apache?

Re: The One in Which I Say Open Source Software Sucks

#45

Post by tptacek »

jodrellblank wrote: post #39
tptacek wrote: post #24

There's nothing in this blog post that's blatantly wrong. There's also nothing in it that's news. It's not written better than other sources that have made the same point, which sources include several famous blog posts from usability and UI experts. The author isn't a usability or UI expert. In fact, I'm not sure who he is.

If he's making the same point as usability and UI experts, why does it matter who he is ?

It wouldn't, if he had something novel to say, or an interesting or effective way of phrasing it.

Re: The One in Which I Say Open Source Software Sucks

#46

Post by gecko »

jodrellblank wrote: post #39
tptacek wrote: post #24

There's nothing in this blog post that's blatantly wrong. There's also nothing in it that's news. It's not written better than other sources that have made the same point, which sources include several famous blog posts from usability and UI experts. The author isn't a usability or UI expert. In fact, I'm not sure who he is.

If he's making the same point as usability and UI experts, why does it matter who he is ?

Because I am secretly an axe murderer, and who in the end wants to hear an argument from an axe murderer, however valid they might be?

Re: The One in Which I Say Open Source Software Sucks

#47

Post by blasdel »

jodrellblank wrote: post #39
tptacek wrote: post #24

There's nothing in this blog post that's blatantly wrong. There's also nothing in it that's news. It's not written better than other sources that have made the same point, which sources include several famous blog posts from usability and UI experts. The author isn't a usability or UI expert. In fact, I'm not sure who he is.

If he's making the same point as usability and UI experts, why does it matter who he is ?

Because he's not making any new points. The only way his post could be useful is if he was notable, making his agreement notable.

Re: The One in Which I Say Open Source Software Sucks

#48

Post by jcromartie »

stonemetal wrote: post #7

Isn't the main problem for OSS adoption advertising? If you are a graphic artist and don't give a rat's behonkus about computers do you really dig until you find the GIMP(and the continual slog for documentation and understanding) or do you read graphic artist monthly with big color Photo Shop ads, Photo Shop books on B&N's book shelves, and training courses. The choice is just about made for you, in their world Phot…

The main problem with FOSS graphics packages is that they aren't focused on being usable and producing beautiful-looking graphics. They're focused on being FOSS packages first, and software that does graphics second. The combination of usability (or maybe just familiarity... but still, it's the measure of the ability of a package to be used) and just really nice looking results are what put Photoshop and Illustrator ahead of GIMP and Photoshop in nearly every area. I just don't see anybody saying "look at this beautiful art I made with GIMP." I see people making lame fan art and bad gradients.

Re: The One in Which I Say Open Source Software Sucks

#49

Post by rjurney »

bct wrote: post #32
rjurney wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And yet it never works out that way on very many projects. Why is that?

For the same reasons that very few non-open projects have the kind of usability you're talking about.

Great commercial software has good usability because they pay good usability people. These people aren't as likely to donate their time to a FOSS project as are hackers who can code raw functionality.

Re: The One in Which I Say Open Source Software Sucks

#50

Post by 0xdefec8 »

sophacles wrote: post #41
0xdefec8 wrote: post #33

As a dude who just tried Ubuntu for the first time in 5 years to see how far they've come, but couldn't because the fucking liveCD didn't have a driver for my cdrom, this rings true. But for what it's worth, after a few grueling days getting the p.o.s. up and running, I was shocked to have all the UI fluff my macbook has, plus the infinite list of other great stuff that's inherent to Linux. The moral? Just shrinkwrap…

Wait, you're actually saying that: 1. Someone still makes non-standard cd-roms? 2. Someone else still buys them? After learning you are person #2, why would anyone ever trust any other judgement you make?

and therein lies the predictable attitude that will keep linux a distant 3rd on the desktop.
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