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About the Penny Arcade Job Posting

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Re: About the Penny Arcade Job Posting

#21

Post by wvenable »

mkr-hn wrote: post #9
justinsteele wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nothing he wrote has changed my opinion about the ad or the position, except for the parts regarding his depression and lung issues, and how they handled it (well). Overall, it reinforced that they are interested in someone who is willing to take a below market rate, is a generalist in many arenas, and is willing to work 60-80 hours a week, including 24/7 on call. Honestly, breaking the job into 2 positions (no, they…

I'm going to trust that he understands his desires, ambitions, and capabilities better than anyone reading that thread, the discussion around the Internet, or the job posting. This is not some naive kid fresh out of college being abused by a powerful corporation.

Absolutely nothing he has said in this post has contradicted anything said about this position. He flat out states he is underpaid and has no work/life balance.

The fact that he's ok with that is the problem!

Re: About the Penny Arcade Job Posting

#22

Post by QuantumGood »

hapless wrote: post #8

This post confirms that the job posting is exactly what it looks like: an exploitative horror-show * He speculates whether the job is worth a "lower salary" (and, given his admitted inexperience in the workforce, he probably has no idea what a market salary looks like) * "The ping-pong table is NOT a benefit" * He's on the "bottom of the goddamn ladder" and "reminded every day" edit: I'm getting a lot of flak for tak…

He fairly specifically says that interpretations such as yours are wrong. He specifically says:

* No, the conditions are not awful...I love this company

* No one here has been scammed into working as hard as they do, and the implication that we’re all blind fools with low self esteem for being here is honestly insulting.

* There won’t be any taking advantage of starry-eyed young twenty-somethings.

He explains why he's leaving directly and clearly, (including "No, I did not burn out.") and that he likes working there. You're assuming he's lying, which you can't know.

Re: About the Penny Arcade Job Posting

#23

Post by [deleted] »

hapless wrote: post #8

This post confirms that the job posting is exactly what it looks like: an exploitative horror-show * He speculates whether the job is worth a "lower salary" (and, given his admitted inexperience in the workforce, he probably has no idea what a market salary looks like) * "The ping-pong table is NOT a benefit" * He's on the "bottom of the goddamn ladder" and "reminded every day" edit: I'm getting a lot of flak for tak…

[deleted]

Re: About the Penny Arcade Job Posting

#24

Post by hapless »

Lewisham wrote: post #20
hapless wrote: post #8

This post confirms that the job posting is exactly what it looks like: an exploitative horror-show * He speculates whether the job is worth a "lower salary" (and, given his admitted inexperience in the workforce, he probably has no idea what a market salary looks like) * "The ping-pong table is NOT a benefit" * He's on the "bottom of the goddamn ladder" and "reminded every day" edit: I'm getting a lot of flak for tak…

Did you actually read the post? The ladder is about the ping pong league they run, and he's joking that it's not a benefit because he's not winning. He decided he preferred to get a lower salary for a job he enjoyed more. He said he can wear four hats because "The reality is that one highly motivated, highly skilled person can handle all of this. You do not need to be constantly working IT, or constantly managing ser…

I don't have to read much between the lines to interpret a strangled reference to losing at pingpong as a more literal expression of his status.

He posted this on his current employer's public forum, after all.

Re: About the Penny Arcade Job Posting

#25

Post by jonknee »

mkr-hn wrote: post #2

It's almost as if people with no knowledge of the situation didn't know what they were talking about and speculated angrily instead.

... And they got it right. The employee confirmed what was in the job posting and what people had issues with (so many different roles, ridiculous hours, low pay, etc).

It's not that hard:

Want a programmer? Hire one.

Want a web developer? Hire one.

Want a system administrator? Hire one. Hire two if you have any type of 24/7 on call requirement (it's not remotely reasonable to expect one individual to be on call 24/7 365).

Then unless you want to get sued, set reasonable expectations of hours (2x full time is not reasonable).

Re: About the Penny Arcade Job Posting

#26

Post by hapless »

QuantumGood wrote: post #22
hapless wrote: post #8

This post confirms that the job posting is exactly what it looks like: an exploitative horror-show * He speculates whether the job is worth a "lower salary" (and, given his admitted inexperience in the workforce, he probably has no idea what a market salary looks like) * "The ping-pong table is NOT a benefit" * He's on the "bottom of the goddamn ladder" and "reminded every day" edit: I'm getting a lot of flak for tak…

He fairly specifically says that interpretations such as yours are wrong. He specifically says: * No, the conditions are not awful...I love this company * No one here has been scammed into working as hard as they do, and the implication that we’re all blind fools with low self esteem for being here is honestly insulting. * There won’t be any taking advantage of starry-eyed young twenty-somethings. He explains why he'…

He says the conditions are not awful, then describes awful conditions. He says he's not leaving because he burned out, and then describes when he burned out.

He very obviously loves the company, but it's not a healthy love.

Re: About the Penny Arcade Job Posting

#27

Post by Lewisham »

beachstartup wrote: post #19

the job he describes is at LEAST $125k/year + benefits + location and schedule flexibility i.e. work from home if you want, and you can leave to pick up the kids at 2pm. as long as the work gets done. possibly stock or options - depends on the company, but quite honestly i don't even view that as 'real' compensation for 90% of all cases. i can't even begin to know what the fuck a 'volunteer' Enforcer is, especially f…

i can't even begin to know what the fuck a 'volunteer' Enforcer is, especially for a profitable company. sounds like a 20 foot pile of horse shit.

Why don't you try using Google and looking it up before angrily speculating?

The Enforcer system is what the use at Penny Arcade Expo. It's a volunteer system to help run the event, and in return you get to attend things when you're not on the roster. It's no different to all sorts of roles, be it grad students being a student volunteer to attend a conference (and if you want to talk about underpaid, grad student is where it's at) or teenagers picking up trash after the Glastonbury Music Festival.

No-one is being pressganged into being an Enforcer, it sounds like a pretty sweet gig to me.

Re: About the Penny Arcade Job Posting

#28

Post by beachstartup »

Lewisham wrote: post #27
beachstartup wrote: post #19

the job he describes is at LEAST $125k/year + benefits + location and schedule flexibility i.e. work from home if you want, and you can leave to pick up the kids at 2pm. as long as the work gets done. possibly stock or options - depends on the company, but quite honestly i don't even view that as 'real' compensation for 90% of all cases. i can't even begin to know what the fuck a 'volunteer' Enforcer is, especially f…

i can't even begin to know what the fuck a 'volunteer' Enforcer is, especially for a profitable company. sounds like a 20 foot pile of horse shit. Why don't you try using Google and looking it up before angrily speculating? The Enforcer system is what the use at Penny Arcade Expo. It's a volunteer system to help run the event, and in return you get to attend things when you're not on the roster. It's no different to…

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Penny_Arcade_Expo

that's funny, i didn't see "non-profit" or "charity" anywhere on this page. you guys should consider updating it.

i am angry because there is an ongoing, systematic monetary devaluation (and hence social devaluation, dot com billionaires notwithstanding) of all technical roles by people in our own industry. it pisses me right the fuck off and the games companies are at the forefront of the fuckedupedness and loss of dignity.

you chain this fucking guy to a pager and pay him peanuts and harass him to the point where he needs to resign and then flippantly post another job posting with such unbelievably thinly veiled condescension and arrogance, and it's about time an industry called you out for it.

Re: About the Penny Arcade Job Posting

#30

Post by Lewisham »

wvenable wrote: post #21
mkr-hn wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm going to trust that he understands his desires, ambitions, and capabilities better than anyone reading that thread, the discussion around the Internet, or the job posting. This is not some naive kid fresh out of college being abused by a powerful corporation.

Absolutely nothing he has said in this post has contradicted anything said about this position. He flat out states he is underpaid and has no work/life balance. The fact that he's ok with that is the problem!

It sounds like you are surprised that there are people who are not like you. There are lots of people in lots of companies that prefer working longer hours and maintaining their social circles at work. The author of the post says he's one of those guys, and he took a pay cut to work there. He worked at Amazon, he's not dumb and he's not being willfully exploited. So one must assume that he did it because he wanted to. He could have left long before now.

Saying that he somehow has a problem because that's what he wants in life is pretty judgmental. Do I want to work that way? No. Do you? No. Does it mean he has a "problem" because that's what he wants? No.

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