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Silicon Chasm: The class divide on America’s cutting edge

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Re: Silicon Chasm: The class divide on America’s cutting edge

#5
The class divide is indeed huge, but I'm having trouble following some of the article's logic. The article seems to be saying that the upper class are the capitalists that have founded successful companies, and the middle class are all the engineers, and the lower class are the rest of society. A lot of the class divide seems to be most evident in housing costs.

Where do these $1 million tract house valuations come from, if the middle class engineers can't afford to buy them? It would appear that they're mostly owned by people that have been living in the area for the past 20 years? And because people have not moved, even though they are apparently no longer in the middle class, the supply has been constrained and the few houses that do go on the market go for extremely large amounts of money.

Anyway, I'm not sure what to make of the article. There are troubling comparisons, and glimpses at incredible wealth, but the parts of the article don't seem to fit together very well into a picture of what's going on.

Re: Silicon Chasm: The class divide on America’s cutting edge

#6
Cowen bluntly predicted what he called “wage polarization.” The increasing ability of computers to perform ordinary tasks will inexorably transform America into an income oligarchy in which the top 15 percent of people—with skills “that are a complement to the computer”—will enjoy “cheery” labor-market prospects and soaring incomes, while the bottom 85 percent, that is to say, 267 million out of America’s 315 million people, will be lucky to find Walmart-level jobs or scrape together marginal “freelance” livings running $25-a-pop errands for their betters via TaskRabbit (say, picking up and delivering a pair of designer shoes from Nordstrom) or renting out their spare bedrooms (if they have any) to overnight lodgers via Airbnb. That is, if they’ll be working at all. “There are many other historical periods, including medieval times, where inequality is high, upward mobility is fairly low, and the social order is fairly stable, even if we as moderns find some aspects of that order objectionable,” Cowen writes in his new book.

In other words, what is coming is the “new feudalism,” a phrase coined by Chapman University urban studies professor Joel Kotkin, a prolific media presence whose New Geography website is an outlet for the trend’s most vocal critics. “It’s a weird Upstairs, Downstairs world in which there’s the gentry, and the role for everybody else is to be their servants,” Kotkin said in a telephone interview. “The agenda of the gentry is to force the working class to live in apartments for the rest of their lives and be serfs. But there’s a weird cognitive dissonance. Everyone who says people ought to be living in apartments actually lives in gigantic houses or has multiple houses.”

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So? Hypocrisy is hardly a new phenomenon. People really are ought to be living in apartments, even if it is suggested as part of some supposed agenda. I really don't understand all the anxiety that pops up on HN every once in a while with regard to some imaginary utopia that is decades away if it will ever come at all - Inequality is entirely secondary to the Median, the article describes a high quality of life all around with the upper echelons of society a sort of step-function above "everybody else". That's supposed to be horrible?

What about the inequality between the US and the rest of the world? I guess hypocrisy is not exclusive to any one tax bracket either.

Re: Silicon Chasm: The class divide on America’s cutting edge

#7

The class divide is indeed huge, but I'm having trouble following some of the article's logic. The article seems to be saying that the upper class are the capitalists that have founded successful companies, and the middle class are all the engineers, and the lower class are the rest of society. A lot of the class divide seems to be most evident in housing costs. Where do these $1 million tract house valuations come f…

The article seems to be saying that the upper class are the capitalists that have founded successful companies, and the middle class are all the engineers, and the lower class are the rest of society.

This view of class division in an industrialized society is not particularly new. Kurt Vonnegut's novel Player Piano presents this exact scenario (upper class of managers, middle class of engineers, unemployed masses), and it was published in 1952.

Re: Silicon Chasm: The class divide on America’s cutting edge

#8
> Yes! Let them eat beans!

Preferably in their apartments.

No, seriously now. I've got a friend who 5 years ago decided that he needs "to straighten his life out", and now he has a huge house in SV and is lead engineer at Apple. That's really fine, and obviously not everyone can have such a life. And people will really have to look inside themselves, and ask themselves what it REALLY is they want. If they want status and big houses, then they better be extraordinary smart & disciplined and/or rich. Me, I just want an office where I can do my thing, not being responsible to anyone else but myself.

A solution to this dystopian future would be the basic income as proposed in Switzerland. This is the only way in my opinion to make sure that a master/slave relationship will not exist, and people are really paid what the job is worth, unpressured by the need to survive.

Re: Silicon Chasm: The class divide on America’s cutting edge

#9
post #7

The class divide is indeed huge, but I'm having trouble following some of the article's logic. The article seems to be saying that the upper class are the capitalists that have founded successful companies, and the middle class are all the engineers, and the lower class are the rest of society. A lot of the class divide seems to be most evident in housing costs. Where do these $1 million tract house valuations come f…

The article seems to be saying that the upper class are the capitalists that have founded successful companies, and the middle class are all the engineers, and the lower class are the rest of society. This view of class division in an industrialized society is not particularly new. Kurt Vonnegut's novel Player Piano presents this exact scenario (upper class of managers, middle class of engineers, unemployed masses),…

I agree that the class division is fairly standard (though the middle class also includes the lawyers, doctors, and other professionals that earn as much or more than engineers), but I guess I don't understand the connection to real estate prices. Who owns all these homes, and buys all these homes? It seems as though it's a bubble that's almost ready to burst, the way that it's been laid out in the article. Or that the wealthy have been buying up huge proportions of properties to turn them into rentals. But there should be numbers that would back up that latter case.

Re: Silicon Chasm: The class divide on America’s cutting edge

#10
post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The article seems to be saying that the upper class are the capitalists that have founded successful companies, and the middle class are all the engineers, and the lower class are the rest of society. This view of class division in an industrialized society is not particularly new. Kurt Vonnegut's novel Player Piano presents this exact scenario (upper class of managers, middle class of engineers, unemployed masses),…

I agree that the class division is fairly standard (though the middle class also includes the lawyers, doctors, and other professionals that earn as much or more than engineers), but I guess I don't understand the connection to real estate prices. Who owns all these homes, and buys all these homes? It seems as though it's a bubble that's almost ready to burst, the way that it's been laid out in the article. Or that t…

It's both: property prices have bubbled up to the point where many real buyers are investors looking to rent the houses out rather than residential owners.
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