Magnus Carlsen is World Chess Champion • Hacker News Board

Re: Magnus Carlsen is World Chess Champion

#31

Post by andrewcooke » Fri, Nov 22, 2013, 3:16 PM UTC

rikacomet wrote: post #17

lobe wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It was the best option in both cases. He was in check when he took the queen, so the queens had to swap or black would lose his queen. At the end Anand traded his knight for the pawn as a king and knight (black's material) can't win, but a king and pawn (white's material) can, so it is in blacks best interest to swap.

what rule is that? are you implying even if only white king, black king, and black knight would be left on board, it would be a draw/win for white by default? Instead of trying to isolate white king into a corner for checkmate? Never heard of a rule like that. Are you sure?

how many times do you have to be wrong here before you question your chess knowledge?

Re: Magnus Carlsen is World Chess Champion

#32

Post by sergj » Fri, Nov 22, 2013, 3:16 PM UTC

aaronetz wrote: post #24

Does anyone know some good alternatives to chess, as a game that mixes deep thought and aesthetic variety? I tried Go, but found it somewhat boring compared to chess, because of its uniformity (which, on the other hand, has the advantage of beautiful simplicity and symmetry.) On another note: it is unfortunate, in my opinion, that chess has a special standing among board games. I would love to see some more variety i…

Boring compared to chess? As a Go player I take this as an insult. Go is way more interesting, there are more fights, more complexity and you make a lot of tactical and strategic decisions in one game. Also you have a great handicap system, playing stronger players is no big problem. Did I mention that there are no remis and pro matches are often decided by 0,5 points which is really little.

I am ending my rant with a quote: "Rather than being the image of a single struggle as in chess, Go is much more like the panorama of an entire campaign, or complex theatre of war. And so it is more like modern warfare where strategic mass movements are the ultimate determinants of victory. … As in modern warfare, direct combat, without supporting tactics, rarely occurs. In fact, to engage too soon in direct combat frequently spells defeat." -- Oscar Korschelt

Re: Magnus Carlsen is World Chess Champion

#33

Post by heyitsnick » Fri, Nov 22, 2013, 3:20 PM UTC

aaronetz wrote: post #24

Does anyone know some good alternatives to chess, as a game that mixes deep thought and aesthetic variety? I tried Go, but found it somewhat boring compared to chess, because of its uniformity (which, on the other hand, has the advantage of beautiful simplicity and symmetry.) On another note: it is unfortunate, in my opinion, that chess has a special standing among board games. I would love to see some more variety i…

Poker

Re: Magnus Carlsen is World Chess Champion

#34

Post by biot » Fri, Nov 22, 2013, 3:20 PM UTC

erikig wrote: post #21

kadabra9 wrote: post #10

Reading more about this match and Magnus in general, I learned of a measure termed "Nettlesomeness" which has been used to measure which players do the most to make their opponents to make mistakes. Magnus, with his highly creative style of play and unexpected moves, not surprisingly ranks the highest in this measure. He seems to have this remarkable gift of making moves which aren't just strong, they get inside his…

Thanks for the comment, the concept of nettlesomeness intrigues me. "...Carlsen is demonstrating one of his most feared qualities, namely his “nettlesomeness,” to use a term coined for this purpose by Ken Regan. Using computer analysis, you can measure which players do the most to cause their opponents to make mistakes." I was surprised to see that this isn't just some subjective measure but can me measured using com…

I think this is actually based on subjective measures. An annotated game[0] will have ?!, ?, and ?? added by human commentators to indicate varying levels of mistakes. A computer analysis can make use of these subjective move evaluations within an annotated game to easily measure which players cause their opponents to make mistakes at a significantly greater frequency than their normal rate of mistakes.

[0] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chess_annotation_symbols#Move_e...

Re: Magnus Carlsen is World Chess Champion

#35

Post by thenmar » Fri, Nov 22, 2013, 3:22 PM UTC

aaronetz wrote: post #24

Does anyone know some good alternatives to chess, as a game that mixes deep thought and aesthetic variety? I tried Go, but found it somewhat boring compared to chess, because of its uniformity (which, on the other hand, has the advantage of beautiful simplicity and symmetry.) On another note: it is unfortunate, in my opinion, that chess has a special standing among board games. I would love to see some more variety i…

What board games have you played? In the last 10-15 years, the U.S. has experienced something of a German-style board game renaissance. Check out Carcassonne, Puerto Rico, Power Grid, Agricola, and many other less popular ones.

Kind of irrelevant, but board games seem like a great application of 3D printing. I wonder if there will be another surge in popularity when (if?) 3D printers become household items.

Re: Magnus Carlsen is World Chess Champion

#36

Post by mattivc » Fri, Nov 22, 2013, 3:24 PM UTC

It's quite fun to see the media attention he has gotten here in Norway. For the last few weeks the sport segment of most news show spent as much time devoted to chess as football, which is not something i ever expected to see.

I'm not much a chess player myself but it still very satisfying seeing so much attention brought to a intellectual sport. I hope at least some of it will stick around.

Re: Magnus Carlsen is World Chess Champion

#37

Post by gshakir » Fri, Nov 22, 2013, 3:24 PM UTC

Cool, it was held in Chennai, my home town. I remember some of my friends along with others (25 at a time) lining up to play Anand at the same time about 15 years ago. Anand was a Grand master at that time. Who else is from Chennai here at HN ?

Re: Magnus Carlsen is World Chess Champion

#38

Post by msluyter » Fri, Nov 22, 2013, 3:25 PM UTC

aaronetz wrote: post #24

Does anyone know some good alternatives to chess, as a game that mixes deep thought and aesthetic variety? I tried Go, but found it somewhat boring compared to chess, because of its uniformity (which, on the other hand, has the advantage of beautiful simplicity and symmetry.) On another note: it is unfortunate, in my opinion, that chess has a special standing among board games. I would love to see some more variety i…

I'm not sure exactly what constitutes a viable "chess alternative," but if you're open to going beyond two player and investigating other styles of games, check out the top games on BGG (boardgamegeek.com). Many of these have a great deal of strategic depth and subtlety:

http://boardgamegeek.com/browse/boardgame

Re: Magnus Carlsen is World Chess Champion

#39

Post by bmslieght » Fri, Nov 22, 2013, 3:25 PM UTC

aaronetz wrote: post #24

Does anyone know some good alternatives to chess, as a game that mixes deep thought and aesthetic variety? I tried Go, but found it somewhat boring compared to chess, because of its uniformity (which, on the other hand, has the advantage of beautiful simplicity and symmetry.) On another note: it is unfortunate, in my opinion, that chess has a special standing among board games. I would love to see some more variety i…

Have another go at Go. The handicap system is wonderful. It make two players of what ever standard have an equal match. There is a reason why Go is old and globally the uptake is far bigger than Chess - it combines very type of thinking. Strategic versus immediate tactical. Thinking globally versus locally. Chess appears too 1 dimensional now by comparison.

Re: Magnus Carlsen is World Chess Champion

#40

Post by mathattack » Fri, Nov 22, 2013, 3:26 PM UTC

erikig wrote: post #21

kadabra9 wrote: post #10

Reading more about this match and Magnus in general, I learned of a measure termed "Nettlesomeness" which has been used to measure which players do the most to make their opponents to make mistakes. Magnus, with his highly creative style of play and unexpected moves, not surprisingly ranks the highest in this measure. He seems to have this remarkable gift of making moves which aren't just strong, they get inside his…

Thanks for the comment, the concept of nettlesomeness intrigues me. "...Carlsen is demonstrating one of his most feared qualities, namely his “nettlesomeness,” to use a term coined for this purpose by Ken Regan. Using computer analysis, you can measure which players do the most to cause their opponents to make mistakes." I was surprised to see that this isn't just some subjective measure but can me measured using com…

Impressive that it's scientific.

I think it also measures how much people are trained to learn all the historical games versus learn deep principles and truths of chess. The great ones should be able to thrive in chaos.

This is true in other fields. Some traders get crushed in non-standard markets. Others thrive.