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The first Bitcoin post on HN

news.ycombinator.com

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Re: The first Bitcoin post on HN

#171

Post by Groxx »

maxerickson wrote: post #151
Groxx wrote: post #120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The USD is backed by the material value of everything USA, at a minimum. It's practically impossible for the USD to go to absolute zero, there's still some gold in the reserves and oil and mining to be done at absolute worst. Obviously our debts exceed this, but that's a different issue. Say everyone cashed in at once - they'd get a percentage of our debts, not zero, since there's still material value. You can't "und…

If the U.S. government fell, any bodies of power that arose in the aftermath would be quite likely to repudiate the debts of the old government. So no, the dollar isn't quite backed by the material value of everything in the U.S. It is backed by the stability of the U.S. government though.

True, though it won't fall in an instant, so there's some warning. And other governments seem likely to hold at least some power over any brand-new government, so it's still unlikely/impossible that they'll get nothing back from the debts.

Re: The first Bitcoin post on HN

#172

Post by sliverstorm »

slg wrote: post #140
sliverstorm wrote: post #126

Earlier quoted context omitted.

there is still no reason to assume that it will ever stop having these extreme fluctuations. Actually I was thinking about this yesterday, and I think if/when goods start to be priced in BTC (not just "fixed USD value converted to current BTC equivalent") that could help anchor the value of BTC.

The problem is that few people are willing to fix their price to a BTC value because it is so unstable. It is a chicken and egg problem.

Absolutely! A first step could be updating prices periodically, perhaps on an hourly or daily basis, rather than every second.

Re: The first Bitcoin post on HN

#173

Post by aestra »

cylinder wrote: post #132
mrb wrote: post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No Bitcoin exchange was running on May 8, 2009. But there is this one famous trade of the guy who bought 5000 bitcoins with $26.06 in "2009" and then bought an apartment in 2013 [1]. This puts the value of one bitcoin at $0.0053. With $1000 you could have bought 189,000, which would be worth $113 million today at $600 per bitcoin. But there is no doubt that buying that many bitcoins at that time would have been diffi…

Except if you tried to unload 189,000 bitcoin you would crash the value back down significantly. The BTC's low volume is th reason why the price rises and falls so quickly.

You don't have to sell those all at once. You can do it over a period of time.

Re: The first Bitcoin post on HN

#174

Post by njharman »

cs702 wrote: post #7

That four-year-old submission has just two comments: one expressing doubt, one expressing optimism. Interestingly, despite growing worldwide adoption of Bitcoin, comments about it on HN continue to be more or less evenly split between doubters and optimists. And I wouldn't be surprised if comments to this submission are evenly split between those same two camps. No amount of evidence or reasoning seems to persuade ei…

Selection bias. If you lack strong opinions you are unlikely to comment. As with almost everything; small number of doubters and supporters on the ends, huge number of 'meh' in center of bell curve.

Re: The first Bitcoin post on HN

#175

Post by thesimpsons1022 »

DevX101 wrote: post #170
pearjuice wrote: post #119

"Why did you buy a bitcoin?" "Because I don't want to enter too late!" The absolute problem with bitcoin is, is that it cannot be used as a currency. If one bitcoin can buy you one "x" today, two "x" tomorrow and in a week only half an "x", what is the point of spending it? Its value fluctuates way too much and that's why so many people are getting on board. They want to be in the elevation towards another all time h…

When don't you spend all of your USD money today since inflation will make it worth less tomorrow?

to be fair, that comparison isn't too valid. Look at the wild yearly fluctuations in bitcoin, compared to the steady rate(3 percent) of inflation of the dollar throughout history. On the other hand, OP is wrong because bitcoins will eventually slow down massively in production(almost to a halt) and stabilize at that point.

Re: The first Bitcoin post on HN

#176

Post by notahacker »

jaxn wrote: post #141
Joeri wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The value of a currency lies entirely in the perception of that value. I don't consider bitcoin different from a traditional currency, except that its rate of production is known in advance. It will keep having value because by now enough people think it does.

This is where the bitcoin boosters start to seem a little looney to me. 99% of my experience with currency has been with USD, which have been relatively stable from month to month. It is a difficult situation because it appears that when people take the time to learn about it, they become big fans of bitcoin but also start worrying about the total collapse of the fed and the USD. I am trying to understand the argumen…

People who take the time to learn about "alternative medicine" usually end up (or start off) sceptical about evidence-based medicine...

Re: The first Bitcoin post on HN

#177

Post by Nursie »

fragsworth wrote: post #167
redblacktree wrote: post #154

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it's just that most folks can't yet imagine that Bitcoin is really going to revolutionize anything. For now, it's interesting speculation. It's really hard to see, for example, getting paid in BTC, or buying gas in BTC.

But I think it's easy to see paying for something in USD, and using BTC as the means of transfer. Customer USD -> Customer BTC -> transfer -> Vendor BTC -> Vendor USD

Yay! 3 layers of fees!

Re: The first Bitcoin post on HN

#178

Post by Nursie »

DevX101 wrote: post #170
pearjuice wrote: post #119

"Why did you buy a bitcoin?" "Because I don't want to enter too late!" The absolute problem with bitcoin is, is that it cannot be used as a currency. If one bitcoin can buy you one "x" today, two "x" tomorrow and in a week only half an "x", what is the point of spending it? Its value fluctuates way too much and that's why so many people are getting on board. They want to be in the elevation towards another all time h…

When don't you spend all of your USD money today since inflation will make it worth less tomorrow?

People do spend nearly all their USD. It's called investment.

BTC, as a main currency, would exert a negative pressure on investment.

Re: The first Bitcoin post on HN

#179

Post by digitailor »

NhanH wrote: post #144
digitailor wrote: post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ahh, someone on HN who understands stores of exchange-value. Refreshing. Just one of the many, many ways bitcoin is better than gold as a store of exchange-value: embedded security. No armored trucks, no vaults. And look at China. BTC's recent rise is partially attributable to the fact it's a so-far-legal method of moving ¥ out of the country. And their government looks to be in support. The reason it's illegal to ex…

Can you clarify your point of bitcoin as a method to move ¥ out of the country? I don't quite understand it. Either way the thing that got move out of China would be bitcoin or USD, the Yuan never actually got moved out of the country. How is it different that it's bitcoin, instead of USD that is sent out?

I found this link as a source to help explain (it's good), I'm on the move:

http://www.coindesk.com/china-leading-global-rise-bitcoin/

Re: The first Bitcoin post on HN

#180

Post by pearjuice »

thesimpsons1022 wrote: post #175
DevX101 wrote: post #170

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When don't you spend all of your USD money today since inflation will make it worth less tomorrow?

to be fair, that comparison isn't too valid. Look at the wild yearly fluctuations in bitcoin, compared to the steady rate(3 percent) of inflation of the dollar throughout history. On the other hand, OP is wrong because bitcoins will eventually slow down massively in production(almost to a halt) and stabilize at that point.

>OP is wrong because bitcoins will eventually slow down massively in production(almost to a halt) and stabilize at that point

Eh, quite the contrary. If this rate of growth continues and production becomes 0, it will not stabilize at all because demand increases yet supply stays constant. Which results in the existing supply getting worth even more. This will make it an hoarded asset even more still not able to function as a currency as fluctuation will still be too drastic.

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