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Why Russians Are Not Smiling (2011)

blog.properrussian.com

61–70 of 235 posts

Re: Why Russians Are Not Smiling (2011)

#61
post #47
post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think you can just write it off as sun exposure. Alaska has fewer suicides than Nevada: http://dhss.alaska.gov/SuicidePrevention/Pages/Statistics/ag... I think there genuinely are different norms for human interaction in different cultures. Why should people in "The South" be so much more famous for being insincerely pleasant than, say, people in Arizona or southern California? The climate in the deep south i…

Hey now, that's cherry picking data if I've ever seen it. Of course Nevada has a high suicide rate. Try comparing Alaska to sunny states where people don't throw their life savings away.

You are misunderstanding me, I am asserting that the data doesn't match the "smiling people live in nice places" theory. Alaskans smile, despite having a high suicide rate and living in a miserable climate. Nevadans aren't know for being particularly pleasant or cold (there isn't a stereotype about the attitudes of Nevadans one way or the other, as far as I can tell) live in a sunny climate and have a huge suicide rate. Coloradans live in an absolutely beautiful state, that doesn't have Alaska's brutally dark winters to boot, their suicide rate is relatively high, but they are neither known for being overly pleasant or particularly cold. Washington has "the Seattle freeze", but has a lower suicide rate than Oregon.

"Climate""is superficially pleasant" is all over the board. Some examples seem to support the theory (allegedly Russia), but plenty of others seem to directly contradict it (Alaska, with a miserable climate, high suicide rate, and very outwardly pleasant people). The South has a miserable climate, have plenty to be miserable about (poverty, literacy, lingering racism, etc) yet are very 'warm' people, New York has a worse climate, yet a lower suicide rate, but yet again rather cold or distant people.

This "Russians don't smile because they are miserable. Americans smile because they are happy" stuff is just pop-psych nonsense. The real world is not that simple.

Why is it difficult to accept that different groups of people, with different heritages, cultures and traditions, might have ever so slightly different ways of presenting themselves to society and interacting with each other? It seems very implausible to me that this might not be the case.

Consider other sort of differences, besides just "smiles or doesn't". For example, consider that cultural differences with hugging, cheek kissing, hand holding, etc are all pretty non-controversial. Nobody is trying to explain that platonic friends in California don't hold hands because Californians don't make close friends like Saudi Arabians do. Anyone trying to say that would be laughed at.

Re: Why Russians Are Not Smiling (2011)

#62
Pretty accurate article. The main point is that smile is a base in USA, and neutral is base here in Russia. But personal conversations (especially with people you know) are full of smiling. And I don't think that's such a big deal, actually.

P.S. I regularly see two people constantly smiling in the crowd. One is slightly crazy and another one has mimic muscles trauma.

Re: Why Russians Are Not Smiling (2011)

#63

As a Russian-American this comes off as complete BS. I've seen this written before and it's always in the form of "It's not us that smile too little, it's you Americans that are fake and smile too much!". For one, Americans don't just smile to be polite. For the most part it's genuinely conveying positive emotions. Now I know this is going to be unpopular, but I think the real reason Russians don't smile is cultural.…

> but I think the real reason Russians don't smile is cultural. It's because they are genuinely more cynical miserable people

I'm not Russian and I don't know any Russian persons directly, I'm from just a little bit to the West, Romania, and wanted to say that we're like the people described in the article, too, i.e. we're only smiling if we really, really mean it.

I think it's a cultural thing, even though I'd have to agree we people in Eastern Europe tend to be more cynical compared to others (we have our good reasons, though). Whenever I go to my grand-parents' village close to the Carpathian Mountains I do have to say "good day" to each and every person I might meet in the street, even though I might not know them directly (I'm a city boy, after all). But were I to smile at the passers-by I'm pretty sure they'd get back to my grand-mother and inform her that the "city grandson" has a strange way of behaving. It's just how things are.

Re: Why Russians Are Not Smiling (2011)

#64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You do realize that most of Western Europe is socialist? That some of the countries that enjoy the highest quality of life and happiness are socialist? How do you square that with what you've written?

On a tangential note, it's not quite right to call the European system socialist. "Social democracy" might be more correct, otherwise people confuse it with communist socialism which is an entirely different regime with much more negative connotations. There are very few things in common between the systems in, say, Sweden and Soviet Russia.

As a European I find it interesting how Americans have started to completely misusing the term 'socialism' especially over the last couple of years. Even those who don't fit the die-hard right-wing profile seem to have started calling any kind of social welfare 'socialsm' without realising what actual socialism looks like.

Re: Why Russians Are Not Smiling (2011)

#65
you could write the same article for french people , it wouldnt make a difference, We french wont fake smile like americans do,even in shops or cafés , where waiters dont expect you to tip them anyway. It's just the french way, and customers are used to it , as long as you are not "too" rude...

Re: Why Russians Are Not Smiling (2011)

#66

As a Russian-American this comes off as complete BS. I've seen this written before and it's always in the form of "It's not us that smile too little, it's you Americans that are fake and smile too much!". For one, Americans don't just smile to be polite. For the most part it's genuinely conveying positive emotions. Now I know this is going to be unpopular, but I think the real reason Russians don't smile is cultural.…

> this comes off as complete BS. I've seen this written before and it's always in the form of "It's not us that smile too little, it's you Americans that are fake and smile too much!"

Which is pretty much what the article quotes Russians as saying. Without agreeing with them, of course.

>I think the real reason Russians don't smile is cultural.

Again, you're agreeing with the article - and contradicting your subsequent explanation, which is mainly economic and judicial.

>It's because [Russians] are genuinely more cynical miserable people.

How is this is any better than some Russians' generalization that smiling Westerners are duplicitous?

Re: Why Russians Are Not Smiling (2011)

#67

Spot on (yeah, I'm "russki") Russians do like to laugh, though. We don't have as much stand-up comedians as Americans do (and skits by the one we do have are very low-brow), but a related genre of satire is quite popular among performers and listeners alike. Not sure if Jvanetsky's performances are available in English, but for those studying Russian I'd highly recommend listening to those.

I think they are plenty of stand up comedians in Russia, but with any humor it's all Russian/Soviet specific.

KVN is similar to SNL.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/KVN

Re: Why Russians Are Not Smiling (2011)

#68
post #66

As a Russian-American this comes off as complete BS. I've seen this written before and it's always in the form of "It's not us that smile too little, it's you Americans that are fake and smile too much!". For one, Americans don't just smile to be polite. For the most part it's genuinely conveying positive emotions. Now I know this is going to be unpopular, but I think the real reason Russians don't smile is cultural.…

> this comes off as complete BS. I've seen this written before and it's always in the form of "It's not us that smile too little, it's you Americans that are fake and smile too much!" Which is pretty much what the article quotes Russians as saying. Without agreeing with them, of course. >I think the real reason Russians don't smile is cultural. Again, you're agreeing with the article - and contradicting your subseque…

>Which is pretty much what the article quotes Russians as saying.

Yes, it was a summary.

>How is this is any better than some Russians' generalization that smiling Westerners are duplicitous?

The 'duplicitous' generalization assumes that westerners are being dishonest. The 'more miserable' generalization assumes that both are being honest.

Re: Why Russians Are Not Smiling (2011)

#69

As a Russian-American this comes off as complete BS. I've seen this written before and it's always in the form of "It's not us that smile too little, it's you Americans that are fake and smile too much!". For one, Americans don't just smile to be polite. For the most part it's genuinely conveying positive emotions. Now I know this is going to be unpopular, but I think the real reason Russians don't smile is cultural.…

As an American who married a Russian and lived in Russia for a while, I find this article to be quite accurate.

When visiting for the first time, I asked my (then-acquaintance) why women never smile at me. She said "if they smile at you, that means they are easy." Basically, they are saying they like me and I should introduce myself. Or, like the article mentioned, maybe I look funny.

You are right in that it is cultural, but the reasons you state aren't the only ones. They are in general pretty unhappy people, as the saying goes "God suffered, so should I." However, the younger generation is stepping beyond the suffering attitude, and yet they still don't smile, so that isn't the only reason.

Your example of the skinheads is just another example of the bystander effect -- definitely not unique to Russia. Also, Russians are pretty crazily racist, so that causes the story to be moot as well.

Re: Why Russians Are Not Smiling (2011)

#70

As a Russian-American this comes off as complete BS. I've seen this written before and it's always in the form of "It's not us that smile too little, it's you Americans that are fake and smile too much!". For one, Americans don't just smile to be polite. For the most part it's genuinely conveying positive emotions. Now I know this is going to be unpopular, but I think the real reason Russians don't smile is cultural.…

as a Russian-american - I found this article to be absolutely correct.
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