Live data from Hacker News

Google's Decline Really Bugs Me

blackhole12.blogspot.com

61–70 of 290 posts

Re: Google's Decline Really Bugs Me

#61
I agree that Google is becoming a lot more intrusive towards her end users and the incentive behind it is probably profit. But at lease for software developers, from my experience, we as a group benefit from Google MORE than 5 years ago.

Chrome

AngularJS

Go

Selenium Webdriver

dart

Even Google Hangout with screen share helped our distributed team a lot.

5 years ago, what did Google offer? GWT?

And, of course, the search engine, we developers probably use it more than many other groups users. I hardly heard anyone use alternative search engine for day-to-day software development related search.

All these are of zero cost to us.

Re: Google's Decline Really Bugs Me

#62

What's with the sudden outpouring of Google-hate of late? I totally get that Google is changing, and has been doing so for a while. But I don't see that as "evil," and I'm struggling to see why anybody would. Google around maybe five or six years ago was a wasteland of shoddy, broken, unintegrated products, many with half-assed, confusing interfaces. That's been tightened up - many of their products are now substanti…

People don't like change. People like what they had. People hate that Google is deciding to move forward. Now forcing the changes on their user base so that Google doesn't have an unlimited number of different things to maintain.

Re: Google's Decline Really Bugs Me

#63

> Larry Page worshiped Steve Jobs, who gave him a bunch of bad advice centered around maximizing profit. What is so bad about maximizing profit? If you make a profit, it means people are willingly giving you money for the service you provide. You make more profit when people feel they benefit more from your service. People can complain about Google until the end of time, but as long as the cash keeps flowing then Goo…

First off, I'm can't speak to Google's "maximizing profit" or what is wrong with Google doing it. I don't know anything about Google outside of what I read on the internet.

I can speak firsthand to seeing what happens when a company tries to maximize profit -- actually two companies.

One was a life insurance company with about 1,300 employees; another a tech company with around 500. The life insurance company was bought out by a large conglomerate and then a "management consulting / efficiency" company was brought in to "help". What really happened was the consulting company decided who was going to get laid off and who wasn't. While there was some dead weight in the company, many of the people laid off were not the dead weight - not sure how they really decided, but the outcome was not good from a personnel standpoint - it might have been from a profit standpoint initially. After that, morale was destroyed as well as the management culture becoming poisonous. Example: IT director charging departments for new computers and then keeping them for his area and giving the other departments his old ones. Basically it became a dog-eat-dog company that was eventually purchased by AIG - and most of us can remember what happened to that company.

The other company was a software and consulting company that was run by one of the founders until he decided to step back from the day to day operations (after he made a boatload of money) and have his accountant friend run the company. Prior to this, the company was one of the best to work for in the area. Its consultants were considered top-notch and the benefits were incredible. Since the accountant took over, morale is horrible and benefits are way down. I could go into detail, but you can find examples of bad cost cutting and morale busting decisions all over the internet - it seemed like this company did a lot of them.

The point is, maximizing profit often comes at the expense of the people who work for the company; and isn't good in the long run for the people or the company.

Re: Google's Decline Really Bugs Me

#64
post #55

What's with the sudden outpouring of Google-hate of late? I totally get that Google is changing, and has been doing so for a while. But I don't see that as "evil," and I'm struggling to see why anybody would. Google around maybe five or six years ago was a wasteland of shoddy, broken, unintegrated products, many with half-assed, confusing interfaces. That's been tightened up - many of their products are now substanti…

it looks like you answered your own question (at least partially): "GMail's [new] interface pisses me off, the new Maps layout is infuriating" ... but there is many other reasons to dislike Google's choices... I still miss the - and + operator when using Google search for example (this change happened when they started to push Google+)

- still exists, and + is now "". That is, "foo" forces foo to appear exactly, just as +foo did.

Re: Google's Decline Really Bugs Me

#65
If you ask me, one of Google's biggest strategic successes was their ability to convince an entire generation of engineers that they were something other than a company. The way many (otherwise intelligent) people talk about it, you'd think it was a religion.

What you're seeing here is not the shattering of a dream, but of an illusion -- Google hasn't been a scrappy, idealistic startup for many years. It's a fine company, but it's a big company -- a collection of tens of thousands of people, all motivated by different hopes and dreams. No institution of that size behaves consistently, let alone consistently benevolently.

In other words: stop setting up false idols, and your reality won't be shattered when they disappoint you.

Re: Google's Decline Really Bugs Me

#66

What's with the sudden outpouring of Google-hate of late? I totally get that Google is changing, and has been doing so for a while. But I don't see that as "evil," and I'm struggling to see why anybody would. Google around maybe five or six years ago was a wasteland of shoddy, broken, unintegrated products, many with half-assed, confusing interfaces. That's been tightened up - many of their products are now substanti…

It's an avalanche effect. Once someone posts about Google, others start thinking and posting, and so on. Or maybe you can think of it like pinball machine, the ball goes in, and then just keeps bouncing around until eventually it dies down.

We have those often about languages, databases, operating system and so on. Sometime we see the opposite technology pop up. Like say one writes about "Why MySQL is awesome" then expect "Why MongoDB is the real deal" to appear on the front page.

Re: Google's Decline Really Bugs Me

#68
One of the most salient facts to me is that Google was formed as a rebellion against the existing search companies and their business practices. I think "don't be evil" and "organizing the world's information" were entirely sincere, and I miss that spirit. Now I can't really distinguish them from any other company.

As hegemons go, I guess they're still better than average. And they're way better than Microsoft. But Google's decline makes me wonder where they're going to bottom out.

Re: Google's Decline Really Bugs Me

#69
post #63

> Larry Page worshiped Steve Jobs, who gave him a bunch of bad advice centered around maximizing profit. What is so bad about maximizing profit? If you make a profit, it means people are willingly giving you money for the service you provide. You make more profit when people feel they benefit more from your service. People can complain about Google until the end of time, but as long as the cash keeps flowing then Goo…

First off, I'm can't speak to Google's "maximizing profit" or what is wrong with Google doing it. I don't know anything about Google outside of what I read on the internet. I can speak firsthand to seeing what happens when a company tries to maximize profit -- actually two companies. One was a life insurance company with about 1,300 employees; another a tech company with around 500. The life insurance company was bou…

I wouldn't call that an example of maximizing profit. I would call it a great example of poor management, and a lack of forward thinking.

Now, those terrible managers might have thought that they were maximizing profits, but like you said, they eventually failed.

Re: Google's Decline Really Bugs Me

#70
post #62

What's with the sudden outpouring of Google-hate of late? I totally get that Google is changing, and has been doing so for a while. But I don't see that as "evil," and I'm struggling to see why anybody would. Google around maybe five or six years ago was a wasteland of shoddy, broken, unintegrated products, many with half-assed, confusing interfaces. That's been tightened up - many of their products are now substanti…

People don't like change. People like what they had. People hate that Google is deciding to move forward. Now forcing the changes on their user base so that Google doesn't have an unlimited number of different things to maintain.

I think it's more than a dislike of change. It's not clear to me that Google is moving forward. I might characterize it more as "upward" in the sense that they're solidifying their dominant position. Moving forward is precisely what I fear them losing.

Of course, it's easy to move forward when you're new and have nothing to lose. Moving forward is much harder when you're the dominant player, because moving forward puts you at risk.

Post reply on HN