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Coin

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441–450 of 720 posts

Re: Coin

#441

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've been to a bar recently where they didn't have to hold my card to keep a tab open. So much more convenient!

We are all deeply moved by the future of bar tabs not holding credit cards :) In all seriousness, most bars hold a CC and ID for a tab.

I don't think I've ever been in a bar that held my ID, just my CC.

Re: Coin

#442
post #432

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So that's why this video was so confusing to me. It was essentially this guy sliding someones card (he claims it's his, but neither the device nor the card know, right?) and then happily paying stuff with it through his fake replica (or the high-tech version of it, the 'coin'). It seemed like a completely unusable system for it's complete lack of any security. (Particularly if you consider there are now live payment…

Theoretically, the creators of coin can implement some sort of security in these sorts of situations: 1) They require you to register this "coin" device 2) They require you to add some banking account details Now, if you were to "clone" someone else's card without their permission, the trail would lead directly to you...

so, you think they'll accept liability for fraud?

I don't think so, there's also no way for anyone to trace the transaction back to them

Re: Coin

#443
post #190
post #167

SUPER clever idea -- kudos for that. In theory, this is awesome. As a consumer, I love it. As a merchant, however (which I am), there is no chance I would accept this. None. Unless the issuers (that is, Visa, MC, Amex) drastically change their policies, which I don't see happening anytime soon. Why? Because the issuers are very clear about a few things: When push comes to shove and it REALLY gets down to it, unless t…

I love the idea behind Coin but what I need is a fat wallet. I carry 19 cards, of which 16 are essential. Some of them are not for swiping so they wouldn't benefit from Coin. The solution for me is a wallet that can hold 20 to 30 cards, but as far as I can tell there's no such thing.

I use this wallet: http://www.vat19.com/dvds/the-mighty-wallet.cfm

It's paper thin, but strong enough that it hasn't fallen apart after years of use. It only has 6 pockets though, so it's not going to separate all of your cards.

Re: Coin

#444

I'm guessing the Coin pre-order is why Protean sent me an email yesterday reminding me they exist: http://getprotean.com Their Echo card is exactly the same idea, with some minor variation in implementation. It has not yet launched. As far as the concerns voiced here (accidental button presses, etc.), Chris Bartenstein, a Protean co-founder, has addressed some of that in the comments on this TechCrunch story: http://…

Doing hardware is hard. Protean's CTO, Henry Balanon, spoke at the Code Michigan civic hackathon on that very subject:

http://www.slideshare.net/balanon1/code-michigan-without-com...

Its not always the first product to ship that wins, its the best product that ships. I've seen the product evolve and the echo card is worth the wait.

Re: Coin

#445
post #167

SUPER clever idea -- kudos for that. In theory, this is awesome. As a consumer, I love it. As a merchant, however (which I am), there is no chance I would accept this. None. Unless the issuers (that is, Visa, MC, Amex) drastically change their policies, which I don't see happening anytime soon. Why? Because the issuers are very clear about a few things: When push comes to shove and it REALLY gets down to it, unless t…

If you swiped my card AND took physical imprints, I would be really suspicious that you were storing my credit card information for future fraud. There's no reason for you to take an imprint as well as swipe, since you have the authorization code for the card present transaction, and the signature, which should be enough to fight chargebacks.

Re: Coin

#446
post #432

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Theoretically, the creators of coin can implement some sort of security in these sorts of situations: 1) They require you to register this "coin" device 2) They require you to add some banking account details Now, if you were to "clone" someone else's card without their permission, the trail would lead directly to you...

so, you think they'll accept liability for fraud? I don't think so, there's also no way for anyone to trace the transaction back to them

I don't know if they will accept liability, but they can try to prevent it as much as possible within their ecosystem.

Re: Coin

#447
post #252
post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How on earth is that going to work? Theoretically at least, you can't clone an EMV card. That's kind of the point.

Theoretically, you can put a large number of payment applications on a single EMV chip already, and a transaction will either use defaults or present you with a choice. Unfortunately cross-bank and cross-scheme cooperation has never been there to the extent that this has been possible so far.

With my new card I always get a dialogue when I pay where I have to choose between something like "direct payment" or "pay in three installments". I suppose that's the kind of applications you're talking about? I didn't know this was possible before (and I don't remember my bank ever telling me about it, not that I really care, but it's a useless step slowing me down).

I see it on every terminal I use here in France, so it seems to somewhat work already here.

Re: Coin

#448
post #167

SUPER clever idea -- kudos for that. In theory, this is awesome. As a consumer, I love it. As a merchant, however (which I am), there is no chance I would accept this. None. Unless the issuers (that is, Visa, MC, Amex) drastically change their policies, which I don't see happening anytime soon. Why? Because the issuers are very clear about a few things: When push comes to shove and it REALLY gets down to it, unless t…

You guys don't use chip and pin? This is where you have to enter a code to do the transaction

Re: Coin

#449
post #219

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't know why the US hasn't adopted EMV. It's not perfect, but it has cut down fraud massively here in Europe. They're very hard to clone (I won't say impossible, but attacks against EMV have not generally been of this nature) and the transaction records at both ends will tell you whether the actual, real card was there. The liability is more clear-cut as a result. If the customer claims the charge was unauthorise…

I want chip and pin cards SO BADLY here. Mainly because it would make my trips to Europe a lot easier, where many systems I've encountered won't work on some non-EMV cards.

I didn't realize European automated machines would basically never accept my cards. On a subsequent trip I tried to get chip card, but neither my personal banker nor the branch manager at Wells Fargo had ever even heard of them and insisted I was confused about the problem.

Shopping for a new bank, for many reasons.

Re: Coin

#450
post #219
post #167

SUPER clever idea -- kudos for that. In theory, this is awesome. As a consumer, I love it. As a merchant, however (which I am), there is no chance I would accept this. None. Unless the issuers (that is, Visa, MC, Amex) drastically change their policies, which I don't see happening anytime soon. Why? Because the issuers are very clear about a few things: When push comes to shove and it REALLY gets down to it, unless t…

I don't know why the US hasn't adopted EMV. It's not perfect, but it has cut down fraud massively here in Europe. They're very hard to clone (I won't say impossible, but attacks against EMV have not generally been of this nature) and the transaction records at both ends will tell you whether the actual, real card was there. The liability is more clear-cut as a result. If the customer claims the charge was unauthorise…

EMV where you need to input a PIN Number is simply a way for VISA/MC to push all the liability onto the customers for stolen credit cards. If a purchase is made with the credit card and PIN, then the issuing bank can simply let the liability fall on the customer, instead of the bank eating the costs, like how it's done today.
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