Earlier quoted context omitted.
Those languages does not focus on portability.
The main focus of Lua has been portability.
into other languages, not systems.
Android: The Land That Python Forgot
101–110 of 127 posts
Re: Android: The Land That Python Forgot
#102If Guido Van Rossum can't convince his own coworkers to support Python in their own platform who else can do it? Meanwhile, Lua is not doing bad in both Android and iOS.
This is the best logic I ever heard in this thread. Guido is working in Google, and Google doesn't support Python on Android. Python is just secondary scripting language even in Google, can't take a strategic support. Their primary product/platform language was always languages with forced type (an)notation - Java/C++. Same thing happen on C#. Anders Hejlsberg couldn't convince any other MS product teams to use C#, s…
Guido works at Dropbox now.
Re: Android: The Land That Python Forgot
#103Jessica McKellar touched upon this in her keynote at Kiwipycon this year (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d1a4Jbjc-vU).
Another area of deficiency in the Python ecosystem that concerns me is the lack of any client-side web development story. Languages like Clojure and Kotlin clearly recognise the importance of this, yet as far as I can tell there doesn't seem to be much interest in projects like Pyjs.
Re: Android: The Land That Python Forgot
#104To me, it's more that Android forgot to include other languages. But maybe it was intentional? You have no choice but to write drivers for the phones special hardware, but you don't have to write bindings for all those drivers to other languages ... only the ones (one?) you chose to support. I'm not as familiar with iOS ... is there broad language support for that OS?
Language support has nothing to do with drivers... All the hardware drivers have C or C++ interfaces.
Re: Android: The Land That Python Forgot
#105Earlier quoted context omitted.
This is the best logic I ever heard in this thread. Guido is working in Google, and Google doesn't support Python on Android. Python is just secondary scripting language even in Google, can't take a strategic support. Their primary product/platform language was always languages with forced type (an)notation - Java/C++. Same thing happen on C#. Anders Hejlsberg couldn't convince any other MS product teams to use C#, s…
Guido works at Dropbox now.
My mistake.
Re: Android: The Land That Python Forgot
#106If Guido Van Rossum can't convince his own coworkers to support Python in their own platform who else can do it? Meanwhile, Lua is not doing bad in both Android and iOS.
This is the best logic I ever heard in this thread. Guido is working in Google, and Google doesn't support Python on Android. Python is just secondary scripting language even in Google, can't take a strategic support. Their primary product/platform language was always languages with forced type (an)notation - Java/C++. Same thing happen on C#. Anders Hejlsberg couldn't convince any other MS product teams to use C#, s…
Well MS fucked that one up, didn't they? They should have ignored C++11, and got Hejlsberg to design a new one ;)
Regarding C# and/or .NET's abandonment - is this really the case? It certainly doesn't seem like it, with new revisions of the CLR coming out somewhat regularly, seemingly with new bits in each time. There's been LINQ, this new async thing, Rx, and that XML UI thing. And I know Silverlight is dead, but nothing dies without having been alive first! And I'm sure if you actively pay attention to the ecosystem - I don't, I use C# as a fancy MFC - you'd be able to reel off a whole pile of other things. It might not be quite the PR darling that it was in its youth, but it doesn't quite seem dead yet...
It might be true that teams at MS don't use it.
Re: Android: The Land That Python Forgot
#107I'd point out that Python was the preferred high-level language at pre-MS Nokia. There was Python for S60 for a long time, even before either iOS or Android existed. More recently Nokia made new Python bindings for Qt, PySide, to be used on Maemo.
For certain values of "preferred". Python bindings for Nokia-specific subsystems (contacts, location etc) were released months or even years after their statically-typed counterparts. You just couldn't build serious applications on S60 with Python, just the occasional script; on Maemo/Meego you could, if you'd waited several months for the eventual release of their largely-undocumented bindings, but you couldn't release them through the Nokia appstore anyway.
Python was simply not a first-class citizen on Nokia devices, 99% of development was done in C/C++. That's one of umpteen huge boats they missed at the time.
Re: Android: The Land That Python Forgot
#108Earlier quoted context omitted.
We're not talking about monolithic, do-everything, hacky classes. You could do the same thing in C#. Static languages (usually) force you to use interfaces and sub-typing just so common code can be reused. Duck typing is a much nicer way of working - without having to jump through seemingly unnecessary hoops. The situation is even worse when you code for testability. Things that really shouldn't have an interface now…
C# supports duck typing though: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Duck_typing#In_C.23
Yes, but it's not idiomatic C#. The point I've been trying to make is that both kinds of languages (dynamic and static) have their different virtues. You can drop down to dynamic in C#, but unless you have a very good reason, your co-workers will lynch you.
Re: Android: The Land That Python Forgot
#109Earlier quoted context omitted.
Yup. If we had Jython, this talk wouldn't have needed to have been written. And I'd probably be working to improve Jython as we speak.
I wonder if this new ART system shipped with 4.4 changes anything - Google like Python and Go so maybe they'd have them available as languages that target the runtime? PS. See you at LCAU2014!
My guess is that it's still Java-like under the hood -- at the very least, calling out to API endpoints will be...
Probably doesn't change much at all. (Though I'd love to be wrong).
Re: Android: The Land That Python Forgot
#110Earlier quoted context omitted.
C# supports duck typing though: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Duck_typing#In_C.23
Yes, but it's not idiomatic C#. The point I've been trying to make is that both kinds of languages (dynamic and static) have their different virtues. You can drop down to dynamic in C#, but unless you have a very good reason, your co-workers will lynch you.
Makes sense.