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The End of Coding

alexn.id.au

1–10 of 106 posts

Re: The End of Coding

#2
Call me skeptical. Virtually everyone who has spent more than a few years programming can attest that it has, at the very least, opened a new dimension of logical thinking and problem-solving that is not easily found in other fields. I think the challenge of creating an interface to this kind of thinking that is friendly to non-coders is difficult enough...but the idea that once these tools are made, they'll grok what to do? Hmmm...We're much closer to a future where machine readers can read all manner of text out loud, but does that mean there's little use for teaching literacy?

edit: Here's an example - I recently got done teaching a data basics class, and inevitably, my students ran into the problem of data typing in Excel...you type in something like "9/14" into a field, and it treats it like a date, and moreover, displays it as "Sep-14". But when you try to concatenate the field, or perform some other kind of operation on it that is not date-related, Excel treats it as an integer (number of days since 1904, or something like that).

So Microsoft has arguably done something user-friendly here...virtually anyone who types in '9/14' probably means September 14, 2013. However, this isn't always the case, and if it isn't, you have to know how to format columns in Excel as text. Moreover, the operations upon date types are not at all intuitive. If you've done a minimal level of programming, you get the idea of data types, including dates and strings. Let's pretend Microsoft comes up with a way to perfectly guess what you mean when you've typed in a value...is it possible this will eliminate the need for the average user to have an understanding of data types in order to do non-trivial work?

Re: The End of Coding

#3
The question that these sorts of articles always raise is ultimately , should we treat computation as something like mechanical expertise which is important but can be easily outsourced or is it more like literacy which is critical to just about every profession and is often used as a proxy for intelligence?

It strikes me that the real difficulty is drawing a line between which tasks should be left to technical professionals and which should be within reach of the layman?

This is much easier to define in the case of mechanical devices which tend to be fairly fixed function rather than computers which are applicable in an almost infinite number of tasks.

For example , you wouldn't expect a car driver to be able to modify their own vehicle, but you would expect a lay computer user to be able to do tasks such as changing their wallpaper or installing software on their computer. I wonder if this is partly what is driving the popularity of computer hardware with artificially imposed constraints? Is it simply easier to understand when you use separate devices for reading books and playing games?

It also begs the question over whether simply changing the means with which to do something changes the nature of the task. For example is somebody designing a complex logical system not "programming" because they are doing it inside of a spreadsheet program instead of an IDE?

Re: The End of Coding

#5
post #2

Call me skeptical. Virtually everyone who has spent more than a few years programming can attest that it has, at the very least, opened a new dimension of logical thinking and problem-solving that is not easily found in other fields. I think the challenge of creating an interface to this kind of thinking that is friendly to non-coders is difficult enough...but the idea that once these tools are made, they'll grok wha…

There are many ways to mitigate these issues. The one I like to believe will be the most used would be a entire new way of using computers. Just like Google uses complex algorithms in order to try to give you better search results, I see no reason why Excel can't try to "learn" your usage. I'm quite saddened that it's 2013 and few applications try to learn more about the user's usage patterns.

Re: The End of Coding

#6
post #5
post #2

Call me skeptical. Virtually everyone who has spent more than a few years programming can attest that it has, at the very least, opened a new dimension of logical thinking and problem-solving that is not easily found in other fields. I think the challenge of creating an interface to this kind of thinking that is friendly to non-coders is difficult enough...but the idea that once these tools are made, they'll grok wha…

There are many ways to mitigate these issues. The one I like to believe will be the most used would be a entire new way of using computers. Just like Google uses complex algorithms in order to try to give you better search results, I see no reason why Excel can't try to "learn" your usage. I'm quite saddened that it's 2013 and few applications try to learn more about the user's usage patterns.

Overaggressive learning algorithms can in some cases be more annoying than well thought out defaults. Especially since they won't be consistent (at least at first). Its not an easy thing to do right. For things like spreadsheet formatting, you want to have consistent behavior that you can rely on.

Re: The End of Coding

#8
post #5
post #2

Call me skeptical. Virtually everyone who has spent more than a few years programming can attest that it has, at the very least, opened a new dimension of logical thinking and problem-solving that is not easily found in other fields. I think the challenge of creating an interface to this kind of thinking that is friendly to non-coders is difficult enough...but the idea that once these tools are made, they'll grok wha…

There are many ways to mitigate these issues. The one I like to believe will be the most used would be a entire new way of using computers. Just like Google uses complex algorithms in order to try to give you better search results, I see no reason why Excel can't try to "learn" your usage. I'm quite saddened that it's 2013 and few applications try to learn more about the user's usage patterns.

I guess the difference is that what google does is already somewhat fuzzy, when you search for something you're not necessarily even sure what you want the search engine to return. We also don't expect the results to necessarily be perfect which is why the search engine returns more than one result.

On the other hand when you're trying to do some specific task you already know in most cases exactly what you want to happen, so if it does something else then that is very frustrating.

Re: The End of Coding

#9
I've been working on http://loggur.com for a (very) long time now to address exactly what the author describes. (Note: The home page is very outdated and vague; I'm planning on redoing it upon release; see my other comments about the details here: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=5811801)

And I should point out that coding will never fully become unnecessary. Of course many of the repetitive parts of coding can be automated, but with all kinds of new ideas and unknown technologies that the future has in store for us, custom code will almost certainly always be required.

Re: The End of Coding

#10
I feel like I've been reading this article every year, with some variation but the same yet-unrealized potential every time.

I'm not an expert in "human" coding or AI, but I get the same vibe from both of them -- until you try it yourself, it seems pretty reasonable that someone will solve this problem fairly soon. And it has seemed that way for many years now.

Simple CRUD apps can already be built with simple, friendly interfaces. The simple apps will continue to get easier for non-programmers to assemble without "coding".

But real life requirements get comlicated soon -- your simple CRUD app now needs to auto-charge customers every time they foo 100 bars, unless it's been less than a month (in which case you charge a prorated total at month end), and early subscribers are grandfathered in to a simple fixed monthly charge. How will you click-and-drag that? Or explain it clearly in natural language, without multiple possible interpretations?

People make complicated stuff in Excel spreadsheets, and while it starts off as fairly vanilla, it quickly becomes something as complicated (if not more so) than writing a standard computer program in code.

Natural language serves a purpose -- mostly around navigating complicated social situations, including expressing general desires to others (who have motivations of their own, and will interpret according to their own internal rules). It's fuzzy and generally non-specific because that's how we are.

Why do we imagine our normal ways of interacting with each other can be applied to instructing a process to execute complex & strict logic?

I'm pretty sure we can make progress -- clean up the leakiest abstractions from software to APIs to hardware... -- and sort out the best way to build coding languages so they are as intuitive as possible for humans -- but I don't think "code" generally is going to disappear anytime soon.

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