Freenode has blocked the Mibbit client permanently. • Hacker News Board

Re: Freenode has blocked the Mibbit client permanently.

#161

Post by axod » Sat, Jun 20, 2009, 9:51 AM UTC

ankhmoop wrote: post #145

axod wrote: post #120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Channels were free to block mibbit, or require that users be identified to join the channel. In any event, this was never about Mibbit being used for abuse. It's about Freenodes own agenda.

We (as a channel) initially tried to avoid banning Mibbit wholesale, but that strategy failed. I imagine Freenode had similar issues at a larger scale. I can't say that any developers I associate with are unhappy that Mibbit was blocked. Specifically, on a technical channel: Looks like Mibbit was blocked so sick of mibbit luzers nice! mothafuckers who can't be bothered to use an IRC client probably don't need to be o…

>> "We (as a channel) initially tried to avoid banning Mibbit wholesale, but that strategy failed."

Why did it fail? You can just ban mibbit if you like on the channel :/

I've used Mibbit as my primary client for a year. I take offense at your blanket statements about the "type of users that use mibbit".

Re: Freenode has blocked the Mibbit client permanently.

#162

Post by lucumo » Sat, Jun 20, 2009, 12:05 PM UTC

patcito wrote: post #92

mannylee1 wrote: post #61

So what is an alternative Web Based IRC client? For those of us working behind a corporate firewall, Mibbit.com was the only way to access IRC.

http://webchat.freenode.net/ lightweight, minimalist, opensource, fast, ad free, I love it already.

And absolutely broken on Opera 10 :/

Re: Freenode has blocked the Mibbit client permanently.

#163

Post by ankhmoop » Sat, Jun 20, 2009, 4:42 PM UTC

axod wrote: post #161

ankhmoop wrote: post #145

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We (as a channel) initially tried to avoid banning Mibbit wholesale, but that strategy failed. I imagine Freenode had similar issues at a larger scale. I can't say that any developers I associate with are unhappy that Mibbit was blocked. Specifically, on a technical channel: Looks like Mibbit was blocked so sick of mibbit luzers nice! mothafuckers who can't be bothered to use an IRC client probably don't need to be o…

>> "We (as a channel) initially tried to avoid banning Mibbit wholesale, but that strategy failed." Why did it fail? You can just ban mibbit if you like on the channel :/ I've used Mibbit as my primary client for a year. I take offense at your blanket statements about the "type of users that use mibbit".

Why did it fail? You can just ban mibbit if you like on the channel :/

We didn't want to ban an entire service! Unfortunately, it wound up being the easiest way -- hence, our attempt to avoid doing so failed.

I've used Mibbit as my primary client for a year. I take offense at your blanket statements about the "type of users that use mibbit".

You are an outlier. The "type of users that use mibbit" were consistently abusive, difficult to deal with, and ultimately detrimental to our communities.

Re: Freenode has blocked the Mibbit client permanently.

#164

Post by sho » Sat, Jun 20, 2009, 5:08 PM UTC

SohumB wrote: post #153

axod wrote: post #62

This is a sad thing in terms of Freenode, and users trying to access it from Mibbit, but will not affect Mibbit as such. I remember using Freenode early on when I discovered open source. It was a fantastic vibrant place with hackers all over the place. openprojects, lilo, great... Unfortunately, maybe it's got too big. The atmosphere has changed for the worse IMHO. In my opinion, the staff no longer represent the com…

This is either deliberate FUD or an accidental misconstruing of what they said. I'm not a freenode staffer, but I was in the channel while this discussion was ongoing. What they did say was that: 1) the WEBIRC protocol, which mibbit pushes heavily, is fundamentally not trustable unless you know exactly what code is running 2) there are additional incentives for a commercial enterprise to potentially abuse any level o…

I have no idea why you are being voted down. Your comments are useful and relevant. It's a disgrace that Mibbit is being given the benefit of the doubt here just because their founder is an HN member.

Re: Freenode has blocked the Mibbit client permanently.

#165

Post by axod » Sat, Jun 20, 2009, 11:56 PM UTC

ankhmoop wrote: post #163

axod wrote: post #161

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>> "We (as a channel) initially tried to avoid banning Mibbit wholesale, but that strategy failed." Why did it fail? You can just ban mibbit if you like on the channel :/ I've used Mibbit as my primary client for a year. I take offense at your blanket statements about the "type of users that use mibbit".

Why did it fail? You can just ban mibbit if you like on the channel :/ We didn't want to ban an entire service! Unfortunately, it wound up being the easiest way -- hence, our attempt to avoid doing so failed. I've used Mibbit as my primary client for a year. I take offense at your blanket statements about the "type of users that use mibbit". You are an outlier. The "type of users that use mibbit" were consistently ab…

I'm not an outlier, and I have quite a lot of data on the users of Mibbit. The vast majority are not abusive or detrimental to any community.

Re: Freenode has blocked the Mibbit client permanently.

#166

Post by axod » Sun, Jun 21, 2009, 8:22 AM UTC

ankhmoop wrote: post #136

axod wrote: post #117

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You should block email from webmail clients. I hear they're very easy to use.

Quite a few registration forms do block webmail addresses for reasons of abuse.

Registration forms that were built in the 90s, agreed.

Re: Freenode has blocked the Mibbit client permanently.

#167

Post by axod » Sun, Jun 21, 2009, 8:23 AM UTC

blueben wrote: post #158

axod wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Another fun quote: jtrucks: because mibbit users are retards and they think mibbit is the only way

Are you airing a legitimate complaint, or are you now simply embarking on a smear campaign to make them look bad and rally folks to your cause?

I was simply providing another quote from the same user the parent quoted.

Re: Freenode has blocked the Mibbit client permanently.

#168

Post by axod » Sun, Jun 21, 2009, 8:33 AM UTC

SohumB wrote: post #153

axod wrote: post #62

This is a sad thing in terms of Freenode, and users trying to access it from Mibbit, but will not affect Mibbit as such. I remember using Freenode early on when I discovered open source. It was a fantastic vibrant place with hackers all over the place. openprojects, lilo, great... Unfortunately, maybe it's got too big. The atmosphere has changed for the worse IMHO. In my opinion, the staff no longer represent the com…

This is either deliberate FUD or an accidental misconstruing of what they said. I'm not a freenode staffer, but I was in the channel while this discussion was ongoing. What they did say was that: 1) the WEBIRC protocol, which mibbit pushes heavily, is fundamentally not trustable unless you know exactly what code is running 2) there are additional incentives for a commercial enterprise to potentially abuse any level o…

Networks differ massively on these points.

EFNet for example was more than happy to setup WEBIRC. So are hundreds of others. For Mibbit, it's the cleanest, least hassle solution. It needs no management. The networks own security handles everything. That is why it's recommended.

I'm really skeptical that abusing trust would be a good thing to do - if trust has been broken, networks can just ban you easily.

#3 I disagree with strongly. I have tried extremely hard to have an open dialog with freenode, to get details of any abuse, to get any email reports to abuse@mibbit.com or PM.

I'm working on new anti-abuse features for non-webirc networks that will hopefully help here.

Re: Freenode has blocked the Mibbit client permanently.

#169

Post by axod » Sun, Jun 21, 2009, 8:33 AM UTC

SohumB wrote: post #157

axod wrote: post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>> Mibbit certainly does not have any incentive to block proxies, it's interested only in ad views. Mibbit blocks all known web proxies, tor, etc and has done for a long time. You really do think the worst of everyone don't you. I wonder what that says about you? :/

You really do think the worst of everyone don't you. I wonder what that says about you? That he's someone I'd hire to deal with network security.

How can he trust you'd pay him?

Re: Freenode has blocked the Mibbit client permanently.

#170

Post by axod » Sun, Jun 21, 2009, 8:52 AM UTC

Zev wrote: post #143

allenbrunson wrote: post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You are agreeing with someone who said "mibbit users are retards." That's not the kind of language that's encouraged around here.

Oh. Thanks for explaining. I didn't mean to imply that mibbit users are retarded. Just that they don't quite know (or care?) as much about IRC as other people do.

I take offense at that. Do you have enough data to make that judgement? Out of the millions of people using Mibbit, you've done a survey and measured? Or is it just more likely that you'll notice if someone causing abuse is using mibbit?