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An interview with Bill Gates

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Re: An interview with Bill Gates

#131

Post by sanoli »

DanBC wrote: post #47

An excellent example of why HN doesn't allow submitters to fuck around with the article title. rshlo has editorialized this title, and thus some comments here are pointless knee-jerk reactions to a bad title, rather than a reaction to what's actually in the article.

I'm with you. I also hate when submitters mess around with titles, since the journalist has already (a lot of the time) messed around and hand picked a quote or chose a sensationalist header. Then comes the HN submitter and double-fucks around.

Re: An interview with Bill Gates

#132

Post by sanoli »

mistermann wrote: post #49
spiritplumber wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not sure how, that's the thing. Do I do a video time lapse? It's a bit boring to watch someone NOT being bitten by mosquitos.

Can you explain what it is?

Is it related to this by any chance http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mosquito_laser

Re: An interview with Bill Gates

#133

Post by sebastianconcpt »

The internet is what helps the guy that cares to help those suffering but without expensive vertical and salvationist interventions.

Help people help themselves instead of making more dependant.

The "more basic stuff" is guaranteed to improve when their own cultural awareness arises way beyond malaria.

Internet accelerates that process. Vaccines don't.

PD: also, is not about one or the other, it's about attacking the problem in both flanks

Re: An interview with Bill Gates

#134

Post by Volpe »

patrickaljord wrote: post #113
Volpe wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Some technology does uplift the poor, but not always, and not all technologies. Baloons giving internet access to people, doesn't seem to have an obvious uplifting effect on the poor? Could you explain how that will happen?

Increased internet penetration in Kenya creates jobs, improves education http://sabahionline.com/en_GB/articles/hoa/articles/features... But seriously, this is HN, do I really need to explain to you why the internet creates job? Why it helps spread information and education? Is this 1997? I'll give you a first hand experience though, I've lived for 5 years in Peru. There, students told me that Google and the internet…

Show me the (at the very least) the correlation between internet access and social mobility.

You may help educate some people, though the data says educational outcome is more correlated with socio-economic status. And education is correlated with social mobility, but now we are two correlative (at best) steps away from the conclusion you are drawing. We've yet to show any causation...

Your outrage of having to explain this, is misplaced. This is not an obvious fact, nor is it backed by any evidence.

Re: An interview with Bill Gates

#135

Post by ivanca »

Xylakant wrote: post #130
ivanca wrote: post #126

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You are painting a fairy tale outcome, poorly based on reality. Even in Colombia, were there is high-speed internet connections the coordination, willingness and education to make a fruitful use of this resource is scarce. So it's not like "Give them internet and they will figure it out!", it's a lot more complicated than that.

That's not what I'm saying. The same could be said about a malaria vaccine. "Develop it and all will be good" is a fairy tale outcome as well. Even "develop it, make it cheap and malaria will cease to be a problem" is a fairy tale outcome. The real world tends to be much more complicated than that - all I'm trying to point out is that there is a real problem managing available resources, especially in countries with…

We all agree is a problem, but we don't agree in that Internet is going to fix that just by existing. So in that order of ideas _by itself_ internet is far from being a priority over malaria and other set of issues.

Re: An interview with Bill Gates

#136

Post by spiritplumber »

sanoli wrote: post #132
mistermann wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can you explain what it is?

Is it related to this by any chance http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mosquito_laser

Not very related. That looks very expensive. Mine is intended to retail for $10 to $20.

Re: An interview with Bill Gates

#137

Post by jroseattle »

I find it's important to have perspective of Gates vs the sili-valley-elites in this debate of who will save the world. It reminds me of this Dilbert comic strip from years ago: http://dilbert.com/strips/comic/1992-12-23/

The implication:

   Dilbert => Gates

   Zuck/Page => Wally
The real issue isn't quite this simple, but only in the context of how valuable internet access is in the context of an individual in a disenfranchised part of the third world.

I'm with Gates. And Dilbert, for that matter.

Re: An interview with Bill Gates

#138

Post by philliphaydon »

Zigurd wrote: post #119
philliphaydon wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah giving internet to people who barely have running water and electricity is REALLY going to help uplift the poor. Solve health issues so people can work rather than spread disease. Introduce agriculture and self sustaining society. Then maybe you can introduce technology...

You might be surprised at the priorities of the poor themselves. Internet access means knowing the market price rather than being ripped off by a middleman for your crop. Getting the market price might mean being able to afford indoor plumbing, but maybe a scooter comes first so grandma can be taken to a doctor when needed. Curing malaria is inherently a top down priority. Acquiring communications is bottom up. To ta…

Have you actually been to a 3rd world country? If you had, your comment makes no sense at all...

Re: An interview with Bill Gates

#139

Post by sanskritabelt »

Xylakant wrote: post #45
zaptheimpaler wrote: post #9

He's right. Poverty, disease and basic things like that are things about _survival_, the internet is not. But mainly, the title is provocative and misleading. The article clearly states, he was asked a leading question "asked whether giving the planet an internet connection is more important than finding a vaccination for malaria", and he answered. The title makes it seem like he went out of his way to make the compa…

> He's right. Poverty, disease and basic things like that are things about _survival_, the internet is not. I'd say he's at least partially wrong. Diseases are often cause by lack of knowledge and education, outburst can often be contained with good means of communication. I know people doing projects that use the internet (or cellphone text messages) to allow remote villages to better manage the available health res…

It's true that diseases are often caused by those things, but in this particular case malaria is caused by the /Plasmodium/ organism and transmitted via infected mosquitoes.

If you're imagining a situation in which one individual in an outlying community gets sick with mysterious symptoms that turn out to be malaria, you have simply failed to grasp the magnitude of the problem.

Re: An interview with Bill Gates

#140

Post by patrickaljord »

Volpe wrote: post #134
patrickaljord wrote: post #113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Increased internet penetration in Kenya creates jobs, improves education http://sabahionline.com/en_GB/articles/hoa/articles/features... But seriously, this is HN, do I really need to explain to you why the internet creates job? Why it helps spread information and education? Is this 1997? I'll give you a first hand experience though, I've lived for 5 years in Peru. There, students told me that Google and the internet…

Show me the (at the very least) the correlation between internet access and social mobility. You may help educate some people, though the data says educational outcome is more correlated with socio-economic status. And education is correlated with social mobility, but now we are two correlative (at best) steps away from the conclusion you are drawing. We've yet to show any causation... Your outrage of having to expla…

> Your outrage of having to explain this, is misplaced. This is not an obvious fact, nor is it backed by any evidence.

I'm not outraged at all, just surprised. I don't have enough time to explain something like that on HN (especially to someone who may just be trolling or acting in bad faith, not saying you are but you could be) and I don't feel the need to because the evidence that the internet has a positive effect on society and the economy are so overwhelming and just a few google searches away anyway. That's like asking why science or education are a good thing for the economy. Have a nice day :)

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