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Patent war goes nuclear: Microsoft, Apple-owned “Rockstar” sues Google

arstechnica.com

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Re: Patent war goes nuclear: Microsoft, Apple-owned “Rockstar” sues Google

#301

Post by mtgx »

shin_lao wrote: post #209
pg wrote: post #61

It's a little early to say for sure, but I predict this will do more to hurt Apple's reputation in the tech community than anything they've done before. And that is not a good community to alienate. I would not be surprised if they look back on this move one day and feel that they ended up net worse off as a result. Apple used to be careful not to alienate hackers. And Microsoft has been gradually digging itself out…

I don't think this is how things will turn out. People will like Google less and less because you can't do anything without them and there is no alternative, and what will happen to Google is exactly what happened to Microsoft: antitrust lawsuits, patents lawsuits, etc. This is not because Google is "evil" or anything, just because they are #1 and therefore are target for more and more people. In the end, this is all…

Apple and Microsoft and joining to sue Google with FRAND patents, that they bought from other companies, and people will like Google less because of it?

Is that how the patent system is supposed to work, or are Apple and Microsoft abusing it to the extreme?

Re: Patent war goes nuclear: Microsoft, Apple-owned “Rockstar” sues Google

#302

Post by tehwalrus »

These patents are just "adverts, but on the internet" right? Exactly the sort of stuff that shouldn't have been granted a Patent in the first place.

I hope google has the guts to use the "invalid patent" argument in court and rule this sort of nonsense invalid in future.

Re: Patent war goes nuclear: Microsoft, Apple-owned “Rockstar” sues Google

#304

Post by bnegreve »

fauigerzigerk wrote: post #226
OoTheNigerian wrote: post #201

Anytime I see the latest "outrage" on HN, I laugh and remember us, citizens of my country that want to protest as long as they are not required to personally sacrifice too much. Most of these companies depend on you hackers (I do not write code) to be successful. If you decide to pull your apps from the app store, stop buying their products and write a post telling everyone why you made the move, they will be hurt. E…

I disagree completely. Protesting against these things (i.e participating in the latest outrage on HN and elsewhere) without sacrificing your entire livelihood is exactly the right thing to do. Being cynical about these things is what changes nothing, or rather it changes things for the worse. In countries where everyone is resigned into the idea that every government official is always going to be corrupt and every…

> Protesting against these things [..] without sacrificing your entire livelihood

If you invest your time and money into say, an iPhone application, you're heavily supporting the Apple store. Once you've done that, the fact that you've expressed your disagreement with Apple policies on online forums is more or less irrelevant.

Look at Facebook: there is a rather large number of people complaining about their privacy policies, yet they keep making them worst every year. That's because people complain, but don't quit.

Re: Patent war goes nuclear: Microsoft, Apple-owned “Rockstar” sues Google

#305

Post by michaelfeathers »

Maybe the problem with patents is that they are transferrable property. What if patents were seen more as a license from the government to an inventor for a period of exclusivity? That would prevent the worst of this sort of stockpiling and weaponization.

Re: Patent war goes nuclear: Microsoft, Apple-owned “Rockstar” sues Google

#306

Post by zimbatm »

bowlofpetunias wrote: post #224
pg wrote: post #61

It's a little early to say for sure, but I predict this will do more to hurt Apple's reputation in the tech community than anything they've done before. And that is not a good community to alienate. I would not be surprised if they look back on this move one day and feel that they ended up net worse off as a result. Apple used to be careful not to alienate hackers. And Microsoft has been gradually digging itself out…

This may be true, but let's not get fooled into thinking that because "they" are the enemy, Google must be our friend. Google is playing a very dubious game here, and it has nothing to do with being on "our" side of the patent issue. They've tried to buy the same patents, refused to participate in a joint effort to safeguard those patents for all, and then knowingly violated those patents. All through this, they've b…

> They've tried to buy the same patents, refused to participate in a joint effort to safeguard those patents for all, and then knowingly violated those patents.

That's a very misleading claim. It's not because they decided to buy a big pool of patents that they necessarily knew that 7 of them would apply to their tech. Moreover it's not clear either that they implemented anything after the fact. Those patents seem to be touching fundamental things like advertisement and search.

Re: Patent war goes nuclear: Microsoft, Apple-owned “Rockstar” sues Google

#307

Post by air »

IBM wrote: post #294
air wrote: post #288

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because Google bought Motorola after Motorola-Apple fight started, the aggressor is a bit more complicated, but still pretty clear cut to me: Whichever side that is not willing to end the patent fight (without payments to either side) is the aggressor. And it seems to me Apple is the one not willing to quit.

Well considering Apple was willing to actually pay a small amount rather than no payment at all, I don't see how you can see them as the aggressor. Motorola clearly stated that they wanted more for it. It seems like Google had more control over whether that lawsuit was filed than I thought. From FOSS Patents: >A few months after that Zeitgeist talk, in January 2012, Google authorized a Motorola Mobility lawsuit again…

Replying to your edit:

Yes, in the Motorola-Apple suit, Motorola was the aggressor and the bad guy. But when Google bought them, Apple had already counter-sued them. That's why I defined the aggressor between Google and Apple as one that is not willing to quit.

Re: Patent war goes nuclear: Microsoft, Apple-owned “Rockstar” sues Google

#308

Post by josteink »

> "Pretty much anyone out there is infringing," said Rockstar's CEO, John Veschi.

And that's the single best reason provided to end software patents once and for all.

When everyone is "infringing" without even knowing it, without reading the patent or without trying to copy someone else's work, you should stop, take a step back, think about things, and realize the entire system is fundamentally broken.

Or if you have no soul, file a lawsuit and hope to make lots of free monies.

Re: Patent war goes nuclear: Microsoft, Apple-owned “Rockstar” sues Google

#309

Post by keypusher »

bowlofpetunias wrote: post #224
pg wrote: post #61

It's a little early to say for sure, but I predict this will do more to hurt Apple's reputation in the tech community than anything they've done before. And that is not a good community to alienate. I would not be surprised if they look back on this move one day and feel that they ended up net worse off as a result. Apple used to be careful not to alienate hackers. And Microsoft has been gradually digging itself out…

This may be true, but let's not get fooled into thinking that because "they" are the enemy, Google must be our friend. Google is playing a very dubious game here, and it has nothing to do with being on "our" side of the patent issue. They've tried to buy the same patents, refused to participate in a joint effort to safeguard those patents for all, and then knowingly violated those patents. All through this, they've b…

Google wanted these patents so that they would not be used aggressively against them. Google has no history of using patents against other companies aggressively. I'm on the side of the company that isn't using software patents to sue other companies, which in this case is Google. This isn't nearly as complicated as you are making it out to be.

Re: Patent war goes nuclear: Microsoft, Apple-owned “Rockstar” sues Google

#310

Post by kriro »

I wonder how hard Canonical will get hit eventually if Ubunut Phone ever comes close to being viable.

But most importantly: lol software patents.

The twisted part in me hopes every single startup will get sued for all the amazing one-click patents and whatnot that they infringe upon as soon as they secure their first round of financing at some point. Maybe then something will change but I doubt it.

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