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Dotcloud becoming Docker

blog.docker.io

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Re: Dotcloud becoming Docker

#41

Post by jayd3e »

gabrtv wrote: post #18
jxf wrote: post #9

As a user of Docker, I'm excited. But as someone who uses the dotCloud PaaS right now to run a company, I'm a little annoyed, mostly at myself for not seeing this coming. Clearly there's a diversion of resources away from the dotCloud PaaS to Docker, and that's going to have a toll somewhere. Despite the company's reassurances that everything is business as usual, I know that Docker [the project] is just too much of…

Gabriel Monroy here, creator of Deis, one of the Docker PaaS's ( http://deis.io/overview/ ). I'd love to pick your brain about your current dilemma and see if we can help. Email me: gabriel _at_ opdemand.com.

Mind if I e-mail you too? My company is considering using deis for deployment in the near future.

Re: Dotcloud becoming Docker

#42

Post by hrvbr »

jxf wrote: post #9

As a user of Docker, I'm excited. But as someone who uses the dotCloud PaaS right now to run a company, I'm a little annoyed, mostly at myself for not seeing this coming. Clearly there's a diversion of resources away from the dotCloud PaaS to Docker, and that's going to have a toll somewhere. Despite the company's reassurances that everything is business as usual, I know that Docker [the project] is just too much of…

Windows Azure has the features you listed, although I'm not sure about #4. I too wanted a PaaS cloud, not an IaaS, and I found Azure to be the best option for my needs. I would have prefered a European company for legal reasons but there's no good one yet.

Re: Dotcloud becoming Docker

#43

Post by keeblus »

pron wrote: post #37
shrikrishna wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Think about it as a very lightweight VM. You can do everything you can in a VM (which, in turn, can do everything you can in your regular system). Only thing is, it is a wrapper over lxc (Linux Containers) which means that you can only run Linux flavors and the host needs to have an advanced kernel (~3.8). Advantage is that if a VM needs ~80s to boot, a docker container can boot in <2s. And that's possible because a…

Oh, so it's not only a deployment mechanism, but an actual runtime "VM". What does it add over linux containers?

Technically - Creation, management, communication, networking. Smartly.

Ecosystem - more and more people every day are integrating with their tools, building business around Docker, or extending support of existing business to Docker.

Re: Dotcloud becoming Docker

#44

Post by shykes »

pron wrote: post #37
shrikrishna wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Think about it as a very lightweight VM. You can do everything you can in a VM (which, in turn, can do everything you can in your regular system). Only thing is, it is a wrapper over lxc (Linux Containers) which means that you can only run Linux flavors and the host needs to have an advanced kernel (~3.8). Advantage is that if a VM needs ~80s to boot, a docker container can boot in <2s. And that's possible because a…

Oh, so it's not only a deployment mechanism, but an actual runtime "VM". What does it add over linux containers?

I gave some of my thoughts on the topic here: http://stackoverflow.com/questions/17989306/what-does-docker...

Re: Dotcloud becoming Docker

#45

Post by BHSPitMonkey »

pron wrote: post #37
shrikrishna wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Think about it as a very lightweight VM. You can do everything you can in a VM (which, in turn, can do everything you can in your regular system). Only thing is, it is a wrapper over lxc (Linux Containers) which means that you can only run Linux flavors and the host needs to have an advanced kernel (~3.8). Advantage is that if a VM needs ~80s to boot, a docker container can boot in <2s. And that's possible because a…

Oh, so it's not only a deployment mechanism, but an actual runtime "VM". What does it add over linux containers?

Linux containers are its main ingredient. Docker itself provides a system for constructing the container images (with a neat super-fast caching/inheritance system that can pull from a central image repository), and manages the lifecycle of the containers. It also does some magic with ports and service discovery.

Re: Dotcloud becoming Docker

#47

Post by yummyfajitas »

jxf wrote: post #9

As a user of Docker, I'm excited. But as someone who uses the dotCloud PaaS right now to run a company, I'm a little annoyed, mostly at myself for not seeing this coming. Clearly there's a diversion of resources away from the dotCloud PaaS to Docker, and that's going to have a toll somewhere. Despite the company's reassurances that everything is business as usual, I know that Docker [the project] is just too much of…

There are lots of hosting providers besides digitalocean - linode is a big one, so is joyent.

I've been trying out digitalocean, but they make me nervous about reliability. Twice in 2 weeks I've gotten nonsensical abuse notifications (spamming, copyright infringement). One of the complaints was only 10 minutes after I spun up a droplet - my deploy script hadn't even finished. Makes me very nervous that DO will shut off all my droplets due to complaints about what the guy who previously owned the IP address did.

MPAA-based failure is far harder to plan for than disk failure.

Re: Dotcloud becoming Docker

#48

Post by bacongobbler »

jxf wrote: post #9

As a user of Docker, I'm excited. But as someone who uses the dotCloud PaaS right now to run a company, I'm a little annoyed, mostly at myself for not seeing this coming. Clearly there's a diversion of resources away from the dotCloud PaaS to Docker, and that's going to have a toll somewhere. Despite the company's reassurances that everything is business as usual, I know that Docker [the project] is just too much of…

There are a couple other PaaS options as well coming in the near future. For open source options that are currently in development, there's https://flynn.io/ and http://deis.io/. For production-ready Enterprise private PaaS (meaning that you host the PaaS on your own hardware) that are currently ready for production use, there's Stackato (http://www.activestate.com/stackato), OpenShift (https://www.openshift.com/), and Cloud Foundry (http://www.cloudfoundry.com/).

If you're just looking to deploy a single application on Digital Ocean or some other VPS, the digitalocean plugin for knife will really help out (https://github.com/rmoriz/knife-digital_ocean).

EDIT: In regards to Stackato...

-- (1) command-line client for deployment via git repository and doing anything related to deployment (add new instances, remove instances, create new environments, assign domains to the PaaS router, etc.)

We have a CLI for doing this, as well as a web API and a Python library for communicating with the API (see https://github.com/bacongobbler/python-stackato)

-- (2) clear pricing

We have a clear memory-based pricing plan. This allows users to scale out their infrastructure to as many nodes as they like, and only have to manage their total memory in their clusters to figure out pricing.

-- (3) I can pay for more memory as I need it

It's on your own hardware. EC2/Rackspace/VMWare pricing depends on their model.

-- (4) ability to specify environment variables in a configuration file that take effect on the container process

We have a couple of default env vars in the application container, as well as letting users configure their own envvars. See http://docs.stackato.com/reference/environment.html and http://docs.stackato.com/reference/stackatoyml.html

-- (5) web interface for administering the account

We have both the CLI, the API, and a web interface. Check out our YouTube channel at http://www.youtube.com/user/ActiveStateSoftware for tutorials around the Stackato console, or just take a look at http://docs.stackato.com/ :)

Disclaimer: I work as a product manager for ActiveState, working on Stackato. We'd love to have you over here! We're also on Freenode, channel #stackato if anyone is interested in this stuff :)

Re: Dotcloud becoming Docker

#49

Post by Myrmornis »

Docker shall not be distributed or downloaded to or in Cuba, Iran, North Korea, Sudan or Syria

This statement occurs in the docker README[0]. If at all possible, one would want to keep such channeling of potentially offensive government policy out of an open source software project's public documentation. For one thing, there are many enthusiastic open source programmers residing in the above list of countries.

The NOTICE[1] document explains that

Like all software products that utilize cryptography, the export and use of Docker is subject to the U.S. Commerce Department's Export Administration Regulations (EAR) because it uses or contains cryptography (see http://www.bis.doc.gov/index.php/policy-guidance/encryption). Certain free and open source software projects have a lightweight set of requirements, which can generally be met by providing email notice to the appropriate U.S. government agencies that their source code is available on a publicly available repository and making the appropriate statements in the README.

I'm not familiar with seeing other open source projects from American organizations state that they may not be downloaded in the above list of countries. Is the use of cryptography in docker different in a way that makes the docker organization more at risk from legal challenges from the federal government in this regard, or are docker being anal and xenophobic in blithely displaying this notice?

[0] https://github.com/dotcloud/docker/blob/master/README.md

[1] https://github.com/dotcloud/docker/blob/master/NOTICE

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