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Argentina's Currency Black Market

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81–90 of 114 posts

Re: Argentina's Currency Black Market

#81
This black market the arbolitos (literally "little trees", a joke on individuals selling "green bills" ergo leaves, you get the point) has existed for decades and comes and goes whether currency exchange controls go up.

The real black market is the hidden one, the one where millions are moved every day. Just because members of government banned currency exchange doesn't means they and their friends can't buy dollars or other foreign currency, and they do, sometimes subsidized by the government given that they buy at the official rate which is near half that of the real market rate.

The only thing keeping this disaster from graduating to hyperinflation is the fact that for the first time in 100 years Argentine exports are back in high demand, back then it was the British and French, now is the Chinese and Indians buying Argentine food products. That source of foreign currency feeds the vaults of the central bank allowing the current government to keep this Jenga-economy from falling apart, let alone stuff their pockets.

Ironically 100 years ago Argentina used that money to build its industry, fund the arts, providing top-level education to the population and build its infrastructure, all with the best of the best. Today this new money is being squandered by a government so corrupt it dwarfs even the worst of the early 20th century Argentine elite. The irony is that Argentina is building nothing today, in fact most of the country still lives everyday using the (now decrepit due to age and lack of maintenance) infrastructure created in those days (or with the wealth from those days) meaning this time it will not only repeat the same mistake of depending too much on primary exports but it will leave nothing for future generations.

Re: Argentina's Currency Black Market

#82
post #9

I work for a company that does casino/gaming equipment, we recently had to upgrade a cruise-liner that allowed to use onboard credit on the casino floor. Apparently the biggest concern for the staff working on the casino floor was the Argentinean problem. The would take the biggest credit that they could get (this would create net account liquidity problems for the casino department etc). I wanted to look up what the…

I spent time in Buenos Aires and can attest that people go across to Uruguay, gamble and take back the winnings in US dollars. Also the article said there is just one black market - not true at all, there is a huge underground market for luxury non-Argentian commodities such as Apple computers.

Re: Argentina's Currency Black Market

#83

Half of my family is from Buenos Aires and I often go back to visit. It's crazier than you think over there. Not too long ago they made it illegal and very difficult for any Argentinean to take out their own money from the ATM. The government is trying really hard to keep everyone inside the country and only spend money within the country. So for anyone visiting Argentina anytime soon, bring as many US dollars as pos…

How would a person bring cash into the country?

It looks like there are no restrictions on bringing USD into the country (aside from declaring > $10,000 USD), but taking currency out is restricted to via "authorized" exchanges http://www.iatatravelcentre.com/AR-Argentina-customs-currenc...

Re: Argentina's Currency Black Market

#84

Half of my family is from Buenos Aires and I often go back to visit. It's crazier than you think over there. Not too long ago they made it illegal and very difficult for any Argentinean to take out their own money from the ATM. The government is trying really hard to keep everyone inside the country and only spend money within the country. So for anyone visiting Argentina anytime soon, bring as many US dollars as pos…

How would a person bring cash into the country?

You can legally carry up to US$10,000 in cash without declaring it at customs, I believe.

Re: Argentina's Currency Black Market

#85
post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

McDonald's has become so expensive here in the last months that it's sometimes cheaper to eat in a relatively decent restaurant. I don't eat in McD but a friend recently had a chicken sandwich, fries, coke and a sundae for close to Bs. 180. It's rid.iculous. At the official rate that's around $30. But at the black market rate that's under $4. Same goes for clothing, electronics, etc. It seems argentina didn't learn f…

$180 doesn't sound right. One of the most expensive combos (say an Angus Tasty or something) is around $90ARS.

Bolívares.not $ ... As he said, using the official rate it would be $30

Re: Argentina's Currency Black Market

#86
post #45

Funny to see this post here, since I'm in Buenos Aires for the week, for vacations. I didn't know about that "blu dolar" rate before coming, so I didn't bring any cash with me; I literally had 50$usd, used to pay the taxi from the airport to my Airbnb when I arrived, and then had my friend become crazy when she saw me use my american VISA to pay for things. "You're crazy, it's almost twice as expensive this way!". Bu…

Xoom.com is your friend. You can transfer money from your bank account and pick it up at almost the Blue rate. (Currently, they trade at 1 USD = 8.9633 ARS)

Re: Argentina's Currency Black Market

#87
post #35
post #11

All self-inflicted wounds. Argentinians could have a stable currency and a thriving, functional economy - there's nothing structural that's stopping them. But they choose not to, and have been making this choice for they last 100 years or so. It's a true pity.

No, the problem is structural: bad routes, no security, no mobile infrastructure, no energy (I am not talking about potential energy), bad education, bad transport of goods between cities. And I am not talking about corruption yet... you can bribe anybody in a direct way with witnesses around. You can say that Argentina has all the ingredients to be a first world country but it is just a hope to be at that point. For…

Bad routes - If you mean what I think you mean this is irrelevant.

No security - I am not sure what you mean but I think it's irrelevant. If shopping centers need tons of security to function, this is the effect of economic policy, not the cause.

No mobile infrastructure - This is the effect of economic policy, not the cause.

No energy - First of all, wrong. Argentina is rich with natural gas and oil. But policy has screwed it up. Second of all, Japan and Korea. Countries can do just fine relying on imported energy.

Bad education - This is the effect of economic policy, not the cause.

Bad transportation of goods - This is the effect of economic policy, not the cause.

Re: Argentina's Currency Black Market

#88
Some argentinians are also using bitcoins to deal with the inflationary peso: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e__m-w4N7NI

There is also this post with some more details around how the black dollar market works in Argentina. http://thebluemarket.wordpress.com/2012/10/18/bitcoin-dollar...

Re: Argentina's Currency Black Market

#89
post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Argentina, for years, has chosen an economic policy something akin to a semi-functional alcoholic. I'm not quite sure what about their economic ideologies are somehow forced upon them despite decade after decade of failure.

You don't understand corruption then. High inflation and a low official exchange rate that no one can actually exchange at without insider connections are a way for those with control of the government and currency printing presses to slowly but steadily siphon the wealth of the masses directly to themselves.

You're getting the cause and effect mixed up.

Is it probably disproportionately worse in Argentina compared to the US? Yeah. But it's not innate in Argentinians. Corruption, generally speaking, is a function of something else, usually something that's inherently unfair or unjust. Argentina's economic policies created these incentives to drive people increasingly towards corruption, not the other way around.

Re: Argentina's Currency Black Market

#90
post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, the problem is structural: bad routes, no security, no mobile infrastructure, no energy (I am not talking about potential energy), bad education, bad transport of goods between cities. And I am not talking about corruption yet... you can bribe anybody in a direct way with witnesses around. You can say that Argentina has all the ingredients to be a first world country but it is just a hope to be at that point. For…

The self-infliction is electing politicians like Kirchner who don't try to spend time and effort improving their infrastructure and stability and attracting investment to build new things. Instead, they prefer to borrow money to deliver handouts to the populace, then when they can't repay the money, default on their debts and take over the local operations of foreign firms. (This is before we even get into the suppre…

False dichotomy. Brazil has been giving "handouts" - desperately needed aid for the poor - and is doing fine. In fact those "handouts" are one of the main reasons why it has been doing ok: they created a market where there was none.
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