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My dad unexpectedly uses my Linux laptop to get real work done

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Re: My dad unexpectedly uses my Linux laptop to get real work done

#241

Post by Decimus »

fit2rule wrote: post #166
_qhtn wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your brother is 25 and has shit to do. I'm sure that once he's old and retired he'll be glad to have learning a new system to take up his time.

25 and no time to learn something new? You're doing life wrong.

I'm 28 and since I was 20 I have been saying there is never enough time! I'm an electrical engineer, I also write software for everything from PLC's, microcontrollers through to applications for Windows and linux (and if I feel the need on mobile platforms) I am currently in China for the next 2 months, working 75+ hours a week... There is no time... Saying that I still seem to be able to dabble in learning new things and keeping up to date on the things I already do. In my twenties so far I have studied and worked a hell of a lot, I didn't do it wrong as I have enjoyed myself all the way. I am one of few people who can say they love their job and I am extremely happy with my life. While I have no time, I still seem to make time for the things I find important. That is learning and playing with new systems. If someone doesn't find that interesting they would be wasting their time by doing it. If you are happy with how you work, what you know and the tools you use, awesome! Don't let other people tell you that you are behind the times or computer illiterate because you don't use their system or even understand it. But please don't be one of those people who hate the tools they use or the life they lead and don't make the effort to change and learn.

Re: My dad unexpectedly uses my Linux laptop to get real work done

#242

Post by _random_ »

pavs wrote: post #125
bartkappenburg wrote: post #118

As I'm reading through the comments I see only two types of users: - the hackernews audience - 60+ low level users (no offence) The former group has enough experience and knowlegde to get the system (linux) adapted to their needs. The latter are only using it for either browsing, checking email or watching movies. I think we're forgetting the important 'middle' group: the ones that aren't in IT but are working with a…

The only reason Linux is not more mainstream than Windows is because its not pre-installed on your computer when you buy. Even installing popular linux distros like Ubuntu from scratch on a new system is much easier than installing a Windows OS on a new system. I recently had this experience and I was stunned to see that for Windows I had to search and download vendor specific drivers for windows to even work with my…

Yeah, and the only reason WP is not more mainstream than Android/iOS is because it's not pre-installed on your Samsung Galaxy/iPhone when you buy.

Re: My dad unexpectedly uses my Linux laptop to get real work done

#243

Post by _random_ »

fsniper wrote: post #189

I'm a Pro-linuxer and never have any Windows machines near my home. So this means, Ubuntu netbooks and laptops all around and my mom and sister is very familiar with Linux. They are using these easily. Once I found out my sister tried to install wine via source code :) She needed some windows software for some firmware update and all her research lead her to wine and source code install. The thing is she did not aske…

Lions can eat tofu if that is the only thing available to them. Should've given them a choice between Mac/Lin/Win.

Re: My dad unexpectedly uses my Linux laptop to get real work done

#244

Post by PeterisP »

nkerkin wrote: post #221
mkmkmmmmm wrote: post #119

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's what I never got about Windows and especially Windows devs. How can you get anything done with all that clicking and no unix tools?

You know it is possible to use windows without a mouse? I make a living cutting .net code in Visual Studio sans toolbars/designer windows, we're not all as inept as this thread makes us out to be. Not sure if you're being sarcastic or not, but many unix tools have been ported to windows.

Well the whole point is that it is a pain to use them. There needs to be no difference between actual developers trying to use the system, but I stick to GUIs on windows (I run Win at home, Mac at work and deploy to GUI-less Ubuntu) because the other tools simply suck on that platform.

The available console or ssh apps are horrible compared to the same apps or linux or mac; and the unix tools have sort-of-been-ported, and I can use them through, say, cygwin but they're not 'nicely working' as they should be. I mean, it's simpler to just ssh to an ubuntu instance than get&use the same tools directly on your machine.

Re: My dad unexpectedly uses my Linux laptop to get real work done

#245

Post by PeterisP »

qb45 wrote: post #185
nitrogen wrote: post #142

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's funny; ten years ago the explanation was exactly the opposite. "Maybe young people can pick up Linux, but there's no way my grandma could ever figure it out." I'm inclined to believe that both are post hoc rationalizations of a phenomenon whose true cause is entirely unrelated.

Because ten years ago you had to partition your HDD with fdisk and configure WiFi network by editing /etc/wpa_supplicant.conf. I'm pretty sure none of the nontechnical users mentioned here would be willing to do that . Ubuntu moved lots of configuration to the GUI, making it easily discoverable and usable for people who don't already know where to look for things. Ubuntu may be sucky, buggy and inflexible, but it's m…

The change wasn't moving configuration to the GUI - the main thing was making most of the configuration unneccessary.

End users don't want easy HDD partitioning and easy WiFi configuration - they want to avoid them altogether, and have everything work out of the box.

Re: My dad unexpectedly uses my Linux laptop to get real work done

#246

Post by cstross »

Microsoft's desktop supremacy hasn't been down to "it's got a nice, easy to use interface" for at least 20 years.

Rather, Microsoft is (or was, in the pre-post-PC world) everywhere because of (a) licensing stitch-ups with hardware vendors and (b) network externalities: get into Corporate IT departments with Office, then people will want (or need) to use the same OS at home, and then you can strong-arm hardware vendors into signing exclusive Windows-only-on-our-PCs licensing deals, which in turn convinces Corporate IT that there's no viable alternative to a Windows-only ecosystem ...

Arguments about whether or not Linux is fit for desktop use by non-technical users miss the point: Windows' monopoly status was a virtuous circle (for a value of "virtuous" that approximates to "in the interests of MSFTs shareholders and provides job security for MCSEs") until the wheels fell off when confronted with an even bigger ecosystem that came out of nowhere. Which is the magic rabbit Apple pulled out of a hat with the iPad, and Google seeks to emulate with Android.

The desktop is now irrelevant -- less than 10% of computing devices people use are desktops or laptops: it's all gone mobile frighteningly fast -- but for what it's worth, Linux won. Because the winning Linux desktop is actually a phonetop or tablet environment: Android.

Re: My dad unexpectedly uses my Linux laptop to get real work done

#247

Post by PeterisP »

bartkappenburg wrote: post #118

As I'm reading through the comments I see only two types of users: - the hackernews audience - 60+ low level users (no offence) The former group has enough experience and knowlegde to get the system (linux) adapted to their needs. The latter are only using it for either browsing, checking email or watching movies. I think we're forgetting the important 'middle' group: the ones that aren't in IT but are working with a…

There won't ever be support in Linux for the 'custom software' part you mention. There are companies which won't upgrade from XP, because their custom software would break without IE 6.0 - can they ever want to migrate to another OS?

Re: My dad unexpectedly uses my Linux laptop to get real work done

#249

Post by VMG »

_random_ wrote: post #228
mkmkmmmmm wrote: post #119

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's what I never got about Windows and especially Windows devs. How can you get anything done with all that clicking and no unix tools?

When future arrived we just did not miss it. GUIs are more natural, it's much better then learning each tools crappy mini console DSL.

GUIs are more natural people who are not software developers.

Re: My dad unexpectedly uses my Linux laptop to get real work done

#250

Post by VMG »

arbuge wrote: post #39

This is one way to look at it. Here's another: I have Ubuntu on a couple of machines at home and still can't get them to talk to my Brother MFC-685CW printer. I'm a PhD in EECS.

Printers and scanners are the zit on the face of the modern linux desktop.
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