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Apple’s WWDC-Closing ‘Fuck You’ to iPhone Developers

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Re: Apple’s WWDC-Closing ‘Fuck You’ to iPhone Developers

#111

Post by vishaldpatel »

davidw wrote: post #96
bjelkeman-again wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am a European, I don't know a single person who buys apps on anything else than the Apple App Store. I call that Dominant. Frankly the concept was quite unheard of before the App Store (i.e. other stores existed, but nobody cared). Nokia has a large range of phones, but until know they haven't shown they know how to run a platform. Although I am sure that will change.

Oh, to be clear I was talking about the phone. They are certainly way ahead in terms of their app store. However, I'd still bet that the number of people buying apps on Apple's store is tiny compared to the number of phone users, so there's a big 'negative space' to consider there. Come to think of it though, in terms of buying things, the 'biggest' market is probably all those crappy ring tones and things of that il…

Sure it is... we're entrepreneurs and you're pointing out something that seems to be selling. This is useful - even if it is a bit obvious - it helps guys like me think outside the iphone box a bit.

Re: Apple’s WWDC-Closing ‘Fuck You’ to iPhone Developers

#112

Post by redrobot5050 »

cubicle67 wrote: post #85
jonknee wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Multi-tasking and tethering have been standard smartphone features for a long time. I can personally remember those as far back as 2001.

True, but the iPhone is new whereas other phone oss' have been around for years. It takes time and manpower to code for these, and you have to start somewhere.

Yeah, and the iPhone started with OS X and went from there. Something tells me OS X can multi-task.

(Keep in mind: Playing music and txting / getting phone calls is multi-tasking.)

Re: Apple’s WWDC-Closing ‘Fuck You’ to iPhone Developers

#113

Post by amalcon »

jodrellblank wrote: post #8
zacharypinter wrote: post #6

I have no objection to Apple running an official App Store with strict rules for compliance. I don't even mind that they take a cut of the profits. However, I find it utterly reprehensible that Apple doesn't allow developers to distribute their applications on their own. iPhone owners should be able to install whatever they want on the device they purchased.

iPhone owners should be able to install whatever they want on the device they purchased. Why? It's such an entrenched idea, but you don't get to rewrite paragraphs of books, or scenes in films, or suits in a pack of playing cards or the firmware in your alarm clock. The iPhone is sold as is, why should we expect to use it any differently?

Yes I do. Well, maybe not alarm clock firmware, but if I want to, I can easily rewrite a paragraph of a book (or even insert and remove entire pages if I like). I may be unhappy with the resulting quality, but it's my choice to make. If I want a deck of cards with five suits, I can easily add the extra suit. I remember a cut of Star Wars 1 surfacing at one point that omitted Jar-Jar; while distributing this cut was a copyright violation, creating it certainly was not.

Now, of course, this doesn't restrict Apple from building in mechanisms to prevent this sort of thing. I won't buy their device because of them, but I doubt this bothers Steve Jobs one bit.

Re: Apple’s WWDC-Closing ‘Fuck You’ to iPhone Developers

#114

Post by jcl »

Zev wrote: post #74
fatdog789 wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, it's not. They haven't yet gone after people who jailbreak their phones. That doesn't mean they won't. And btw, they have gone after sites that talk about how to jailbreak the iPhone. Copyright was just an excuse.

* They haven't yet gone after people who jailbreak their phones* I like how you can predict the future... How else do you know what a company is going to do, before the company does it?

http://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2009/02/apple-says-jailbreaking...

If Apple honestly believed they would never go after someone for jailbreaking, then they wouldn't waste their time laying the legal groundwork to do so.

Re: Apple’s WWDC-Closing ‘Fuck You’ to iPhone Developers

#115

Post by axod »

gaius wrote: post #105
axod wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

MMS is useful for talking to old legacy phones :/ Nice to have, but hardly critical.

In Europe everyone has MMS. Tho' this is becoming less important because people on all platforms just post to Facebook or Flickr directly from their phones now, but even so, lack of MMS hurt iPhone early on.

Disagree. I doubt many iPhone users really mind. You email people your pictures instead of MMS :/ they get them when they're at their computer if their phone can't do email.

(I'm in Europe, not everyone has MMS).

Re: Apple’s WWDC-Closing ‘Fuck You’ to iPhone Developers

#116

Post by redrobot5050 »

joubert wrote: post #40
thras wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Come on. Playing card companies don't spend money and time to restrict the "playing card platform." Alarm clocks don't even have firmware to restrict and alarm clock companies don't care one way or another if their users take them apart and mess with the circuit boards. Apple, on the other hand, has worked pretty damn hard to restrict their customers from being able to install their own software. That is very much a…

Isn't it a balancing act to give the END USER the best quality the company believes the user should get?

And protect a developer's investment? Easily hacked platforms become easily pirated platforms....just ask anyone who developed games for the Dreamcast....

Re: Apple’s WWDC-Closing ‘Fuck You’ to iPhone Developers

#117

Post by GHFigs »

jcl wrote: post #114
Zev wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

* They haven't yet gone after people who jailbreak their phones* I like how you can predict the future... How else do you know what a company is going to do, before the company does it?

http://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2009/02/apple-says-jailbreaking... If Apple honestly believed they would never go after someone for jailbreaking, then they wouldn't waste their time laying the legal groundwork to do so.

If you read the actual filings instead of EFF's press releases, as I have, I believe you'll find the EFF's characterization to be misleading. They can be found here: http://www.copyright.gov/1201/2008/responses/

Jailbreaking per se is not illegal. Violating copyright to do so is. The EFF filed for a DMCA exemption which would allow violating the DMCA for the purposes of jailbreaking, primarily of iPhones. The EFF is the one attempting to lay legal groundwork by changing the law -- what they propose is currently illegal. Apple's filing is only a response to the EFF's comments.

Re: Apple’s WWDC-Closing ‘Fuck You’ to iPhone Developers

#118

Post by GHFigs »

igorhvr wrote: post #101
GHFigs wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am not sure why you think its not true or nonsensical by any means. It's a very simple point: there is a difference in the rights you have over hardware and software just as there is a difference in the rights you have over a book and the contents of the book. Pretending that the rules of one should apply to the other is nonsensical. The reason this distinction is important is that many people claim that Apple is i…

> That is all they do. Why would you think otherwise? Not true. Read a bit about "ibricks": http://bits.blogs.nytimes.com/2007/09/28/more-on-apples-late...

Apple does not support jailbroken phones. The users effected chose to install software that does not support their phones. I don't see how Apple can be considered the responsible party.

Re: Apple’s WWDC-Closing ‘Fuck You’ to iPhone Developers

#119

Post by jamesbritt »

jodrellblank wrote: post #8
zacharypinter wrote: post #6

I have no objection to Apple running an official App Store with strict rules for compliance. I don't even mind that they take a cut of the profits. However, I find it utterly reprehensible that Apple doesn't allow developers to distribute their applications on their own. iPhone owners should be able to install whatever they want on the device they purchased.

iPhone owners should be able to install whatever they want on the device they purchased. Why? It's such an entrenched idea, but you don't get to rewrite paragraphs of books, or scenes in films, or suits in a pack of playing cards or the firmware in your alarm clock. The iPhone is sold as is, why should we expect to use it any differently?

"It's such an entrenched idea, but you don't get to rewrite paragraphs of books, or scenes in films, or suits in a pack of playing cards or the firmware in your alarm clock. "

It's entrenched idea because, for most of these, I do get to do those things. I'm free to rip pages out of the books I own, or write in the margin, or re-word stuff with white-out and a pen. I'm free to mix several decks of cards to make my own weird set. I would expect I can hack on my alarm clock too, except I have no idea how to alter the firmware. :) I have "re-purposed" analog mechanical clocks. And why not? I owned them.

Why should "as is" mean "stays as"?

Re: Apple’s WWDC-Closing ‘Fuck You’ to iPhone Developers

#120

Post by marbletiles »

loginx wrote: post #103
paulgb wrote: post #31

The App Store team simply knew what the questions were going to be like and were unwilling to face them. I haven't been following WWDC very closely, did Apple do something major to piss off developers? Or is Marco referring to general App Store issues?

I'll never understand why you have to own a mac in order to develop iPhone apps, then shell out another $99 just to use the SDK. This means that after purchasing their already expensive phone, I need to shell out close to $1,000 just for the privilege of writing apps. I'm in the market for a new phone right now, and I was really strongly considering an iPhone until I realized that those were the restrictions for writ…

I'll never understand why you have to own a mac in order to develop iPhone apps

It's not difficult to understand: the iPhone is based on a version of OS X, so when Apple came to write the developer tools, they extended the OS X developer tools. These, unsurprisingly, are OS X native.

You may not agree with it, but it's not incomprehensible.

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