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Google announces uProxy

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Re: Google announces uProxy

#141

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is a straw man. Nobody says you should implicitly trust Google, the second line in my comment talks about stopping knee-jerk reactions. People here started ranting about Google without even seeing what the actual product is, which is pretty much the definition of knee-jerk. I wouldn't mind people criticizing it if it's valid criticism, but this is just talking for the sake of talking.

Asking why we should trust a privacy related product from Google is legitimate. You are assuming that everyone will comprehend the trust model at a glance the way you do, but this is not so. Your argument seems to be that people shouldn't state their opinions, but should instead do silent research until they come to what you think is the obvious conclusion. That isn't how social discussions work.

> Your argument seems to be that people shouldn't state their opinions, but should instead do silent research until they come to what you think is the obvious conclusion.

StavrosK wanted "valid criticism" and not "kneejerk reactions"; I don't think that's a fair interpretation of what he meant.

Perhaps it is a fact in our social environment that one cannot expect people to read more than the link title before making claims in comments, much less reading the FAQ (at https://uproxy.org/), but I wish it were not so.

Re: Google announces uProxy

#142
post #141

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Asking why we should trust a privacy related product from Google is legitimate. You are assuming that everyone will comprehend the trust model at a glance the way you do, but this is not so. Your argument seems to be that people shouldn't state their opinions, but should instead do silent research until they come to what you think is the obvious conclusion. That isn't how social discussions work.

> Your argument seems to be that people shouldn't state their opinions, but should instead do silent research until they come to what you think is the obvious conclusion. StavrosK wanted "valid criticism" and not "kneejerk reactions"; I don't think that's a fair interpretation of what he meant. Perhaps it is a fact in our social environment that one cannot expect people to read more than the link title before making…

StavrosK wanted a narrow definition of valid criticism.

Narrowly confining ourselves to a technical analysis of ignores that there are other dimensions to how people think about technology, and the perception that Google has created about its trustworthiness is one of them.

It's not as if we are going to explore that topic in a one-time thread and never say anything about it again. It is going to keep being discussed as related issues come up.

Re: Google announces uProxy

#143
post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I did. I also went to the uProxy site which mentions it was seeded by Google Ideas. Also, >> One of the ways uProxy connects you through your friends, is by connecting to existing chat networks, such as Facebook or Google Hangouts. uProxy can use a chat network to discover new friends and setup peer-to-peer proxying from your friends. If a user does so, then the chat network can see that the user has uProxy installed…

.. So don't use it on hangouts and run it on Firefox. Scan the source for any "call home code."

This isn't about me. I already use a different VPN. I don't use Hangouts or Google+. Those rare Google services I do use, I use sparingly.

My point was the average Internet Joe or Jane needs to look beyond "free" services and be willing to spend some money buying better alternatives. One of the reasons we're all so compromised on the Internet today is our collective blindness towards the hidden "costs" of free services.

Re: Google announces uProxy

#144

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can we stop every new thread on HN with NSA spy stories? The NSA can/has/is spying on you for a long time and it has nothing to do with any US company. Much of the traffic around the world (bound for the US or not) is routed through the USA due to us being such a central player, and these core routers have been tapped for a long time. It doesn't matter if you are dealing with "US company" or not.

P2P is definitely a viable solution that makes their job significantly more difficult. It's not nearly that clear what the NSA is doing. I've worked in the NOC and as a datacenter tech at a Regional ISP and we definitely did not have spying gear in our facilities. We had other, regional BGP peers so it's entirely likely your traffic never crossed the Internet to get to its destination. I'm still not convinced they've…

I'd consider it at least slightly more likely for major ISPs.

Why else would Comcast route traffic from the western part of the Mountain time zone all the way to Chicago or Dallas before going to a destination in California or Washington?

Re: Google announces uProxy

#145

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Google is a long-time NSA collaborator. The risks of what they could share with them should always be scrutinized.

Germany is a long time NSA collaborator. If Europeans wanted to they could handle intelligence themselves they could, they don't want to.

This. People forget global intels are collaborating in many forms.

Re: Google announces uProxy

#146
post #85
post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> the source will be readable and verifiable. that's all well and good, but if it's executed by an unverifiable binary build of Chrome (i.e. the one distributed by Google), it's not worth much. For what you know, Chrome might just detect the extension is installed and silently eavesdrop on all its calls. If this extension will work as-is on third-party Chromium builds compiled from public sources, then yeah, it can b…

We actually don't know with 100% certainty that Chrome runs the code that we see. Considering Google is forced to comply with NSA's shit (and other agencies in their respective countries), I wouldn't trust my life to this extension.

Then compile it yourself. If you don't trust your hardware then what else can you use?

Can you actually trust people who built your house? What if NSA has built a device hidden in everyone's house right now?

Re: Google announces uProxy

#147
So now you also expose your confidants? So if you are targeted they automatically get on the list? Why inconvenience the secret service with doing tedious network analysis to flush out your peers - uProxy might (they are not very specific about the security of peers) disclose that automatically...

Re: Google announces uProxy

#148
post #33

This sounds good. But how is it better than just installing Tor?

"just"? Man, normal people can't install Tor. It is not that it is difficult for them, it is impossible.

Also, this solves a problem slighlty different from what Tor solves, in my opinion.

Re: Google announces uProxy

#149
post #136
post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That wasn't my point. Have you ever read the source of the extensions you have installed? No. If everybody has that mentality then nothing gets "checked" and malicious code makes it though.

I have read the source of extensions I've installed.

And are you a crypto expert?

Re: Google announces uProxy

#150
post #77
post #65

So Google helps building a proxy for by passing their own censorship, Bravo Google, Bravo. (I'm being ironic of course) This is what I get any time I try to download anything from Google Code or Android sdk or even read something hosted on GAE. http://s24.postimg.org/gr0lto1l1/work107.png I'm in Cuba but the same should be for Iran and others "bad boys".

By "their own", you mean "as required by US export restrictions that all US companies have to abide by", right? See also https://sourceforge.net/blog/clarifying-sourceforgenets-deni...

They could serve the files in a way that doesn't export them from the US.

Or frankly they have a good legal team, why not fight the ridiculous idea that math is a weapon.

And yes Google do own their own actions, even the legally required ones.

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