Earlier quoted context omitted.
You're not quantifying correctly. Car accidents and bicycle accidents are currently more common than RC aircraft accidents partly because RC use is so uncommon. If you throw in a denominator of operator-hours, the picture likely changes. You should also account for the foresight and preventability afforded to potential victims. From the perspective of a pedestrian or property owner on the ground, it is a lot easier t…
Nimby.
Brooklyn man arrested for flying drone over Manhattan
61–66 of 66 posts
Re: Brooklyn man arrested for flying drone over Manhattan
#62Earlier quoted context omitted.
How do you anticipate a bicycle hitting you from behind? > There's reasonable expectations of privacy for example There is nothing reasonable about an expectation of privacy when your curtains are open. > There's noise considerations. More ignorance, more overreaction. Many RC aircraft are nearly silent, and we have noise ordinances for the rest. But I promise, you won't hear most RC aircraft over the din in Manhatta…
Your emotions are coloring your ability to seriously consider how the 99% of urban dwellers who couldn't care less about being able to fly RC aircraft would feel about them being ubiquitous. I don't need to anticipate a bike hitting me from behind on the sidewalk because they are illegal there, and in the street, I look around (horizontally!) like every other pedestrian. I think that you also fail to understand how t…
Bicycles are not universally illegal on the sidewalk -- in fact, they're specifically legal on the sidewalk where I live, and yes it's in the US. Not that illegality stops people anywhere.
If you want permits, those are generally funded by fees. Talk about that, rather than a knee-jerk ban. As you've already indicated: Enforcement can be difficult. So how are you going to enforce a complete ban, anyway?
A lot of my money goes to things I don't like. For example, your protection by police, fire, military, and the courts. I'd very much like a refund on that. Just for the portion that covers you, you understand. I'm fine with it going to everyone else. Since you're just one person, that's well below your apparent threshold of 1% for number of people that actually matter, so it shouldn't be a problem, right?
Horses can be lawfully ridden on many if not most city streets, including New York City.
It is probable there is some motorized vehicle your son would be permitted to operate in Manhattan. Electric-assist bicycles are often legal on city streets. Not being able to ride an ATV is a consequence of regulation of vehicular traffic, rather than a blanket ban on wheeled transport, as you wish for RC aircraft. And certainly when your son reaches the appropriate age, he will be able to obtain a license to operate a wide variety of motorized vehicles in New York City and across the country. Again, regulation, not prohibition.
80% of the US population is urbanized. Suburbs are largely for a privileged class, and the extreme rural poor would generally be better served if they could live in a city.
Getting out of an urban environment requires the parent to be privileged enough to have the time to do it, and the money to afford the car and gas. You may think this is no problem for most of the people who can afford to live in Manhattan, but Manhattan is not the only urban area in the US. Banning RC aircraft from urban areas covers many high-population areas that I don't believe you have visited or understand in the least.
Try spending some time outside wealthy uptown areas for a while. There's a country full of urban areas you have obviously not seen or experienced. People living lives vastly different from your own. People you want to rip privileges away from because you think Manhattan is America.
Re: Brooklyn man arrested for flying drone over Manhattan
#63Earlier quoted context omitted.
Nimby.
Not really. Unlike a water treatment plant, tunnel, power station, etc. that provides benefit to many residents, flying RC aircraft only provides benefits to the users and come with a host of externalities for everybody else. You might as well say "nimby" about guns or drugs.
Meanwhile, blanket gun bans in the US are clearly invalid per two recent Supreme Court decisions. Gun laws in New York City specifically are currently under challenge in federal court, a challenge likely to be somewhat successful.
Few things that don't involve direct and specific harm to another person are subject to blanket prohibition. Rather, we use varying levels of regulation to avoid or minimize harm. Crying for a ban whenever you see a potential harm in an activity is a gross overreaction, and will merely cause people like me to consider you a NIMBY quack.
If this thread had opened with "we need clear rules about operating RC aircraft in heavily populated areas, let's talk about what would be reasonable", the thread would never have existed in its current state.
But that's not what happened. Instead, there was a knee-jerk cry for banning entirely. The irony is that it is your reaction that is emotional -- specifically, the emotion of fear. You cower in the face of things unfamiliar, while accusing those without fear of being emotional. Projection.
Re: Brooklyn man arrested for flying drone over Manhattan
#64Earlier quoted context omitted.
Nimby.
Not really. Unlike a water treatment plant, tunnel, power station, etc. that provides benefit to many residents, flying RC aircraft only provides benefits to the users and come with a host of externalities for everybody else. You might as well say "nimby" about guns or drugs.
Re: Brooklyn man arrested for flying drone over Manhattan
#65Navigable airspace is regulated by the FAA and the FAA has recently begun to enforce its rules for UAS or drones (see tensafefrogs's comment). The FAA's view is that the difference between RC and a UAS/drone is whether the operator gets paid. They mostly ignore the RC community.
Then there is a state/local regulation of reckless behavior in general. This is not related to flying, per se. It is related to endangering others.
The pattern of prosecution is the feds going after operators who are getting paid for violating the rules for aircraft (any aircraft piloted or not must maintain separation from buildings, etc.) and the state/local authorities going after RC operators who endanger others through recklessness.
All in all, it seems like we're moving towards a rational system where RC operators can play in safe spaces and eventually we'll have licensing and regulation of commercial operators to work in more challenging environments.
Re: Brooklyn man arrested for flying drone over Manhattan
#66Earlier quoted context omitted.
Firstly, your comment is not what I called foolish. I was referring to the original act. Secondly, I'm not raging at all. I'm quite calm. That is what I'm actually asking for. Calmness. With regards to driving not being related because of it 'having regulations', RC model plane flying has regulations too. Ones I abide by. You say it needs to be regulated. Guess what? It is. I've even talked to my local ranger about t…
if I did seem over reacted, my apology. Let's refine restriction then. This news is probably not too old for some local people. http://blogs.wsj.com/metropolis/2013/09/05/remote-control-he... http://www.ntv7.com.my/7edition/local-en/FREAK_ACCIDENT_18_M... In both accident, a giant, powerful RC aircraft killed people. Is this the kind we should ban? From the veteran perspective, how do we go about regulating these? Sh…
The regulations are outdated too. But not only in the high-powered end, but also the low powered and new micro end. I am not allowed to fly the mini vapor (or any other RC aircraft) in any park in my electorate. But there are many of small park flyers that are very safe.
As is often the case, the law struggles to keep up with the pace of technological change. It's really modern lipo battery tech that has enabled this change. Both at the high end, with large craft using 12 cell lipo batteries (50 Volts and capable of delivering hundreds of Amps for short periods), and at the low end with minture 1 and 2 cell micro lipos.
Regulations could have categories based in part apon things like:
- peak power output of battery/motor system
- material of craft's construction (EPO foam vs balsa or even aluminium)
- size, orientation and exposure of propellors and blades (ducted fans vs multiple large horitonal rotors)
- weight of aircraft
- top speed of aircraft