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Experian Sold Consumer Data to ID Theft Service

krebsonsecurity.com

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Re: Experian Sold Consumer Data to ID Theft Service

#31

Post by dangrossman »

johnchristopher wrote: post #30
dangrossman wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Also, the median home price where we live is $500-600K (depending on the city/neighborhood). 30% of that is quite a down-payment. You're talking about being entrusted with half a million dollars of someone else's money. That's a huge bet to make on you; it goes both ways. If you can't afford the down payment, then you can't afford to live in that neighborhood. 30% isn't an unusual downpayment, especially if you don…

Why is the house "depreciated in value at all" ? I don't understand that part.

You just lived through a recession in which tens of millions of homes depreciated in value during the terms of their loans. Depreciated means it lost value; the house is worth less than before. That, combined with a small downpayment, can result in a bank holding a foreclosed home which is worth less than the value of the mortgage on it.

Re: Experian Sold Consumer Data to ID Theft Service

#32

Post by summerdown2 »

mindslight wrote: post #18

Except there's actually no such thing as "identity theft" - it's a mere figment of the credit industry's (tracking industry's) fantasy in which they're omniscient, and an attempt to slowly push the responsibility for bank fraud onto uninvolved third parties. In reality, some would-be bank fraudsters got ahold of some non-secret information.

I think this is relevant: it's a sketch from the show "Mitchell and Webb about identity theft.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CS9ptA3Ya9E

Re: Experian Sold Consumer Data to ID Theft Service

#33

Post by dredmorbius »

mindslight wrote: post #18

Except there's actually no such thing as "identity theft" - it's a mere figment of the credit industry's (tracking industry's) fantasy in which they're omniscient, and an attempt to slowly push the responsibility for bank fraud onto uninvolved third parties. In reality, some would-be bank fraudsters got ahold of some non-secret information.

Google's NGram viewer is a neat way to track phrases.

This one seemed to emerge in the late 1990s (with some very light earlier mentions in the 1960s). By the late 1970s there were statutes on the topic.

http://goo.gl/VvBCHL http://goo.gl/i1KFtF

Re: Experian Sold Consumer Data to ID Theft Service

#34

Post by dan1234 »

mindslight wrote: post #18

Except there's actually no such thing as "identity theft" - it's a mere figment of the credit industry's (tracking industry's) fantasy in which they're omniscient, and an attempt to slowly push the responsibility for bank fraud onto uninvolved third parties. In reality, some would-be bank fraudsters got ahold of some non-secret information.

The UK police[0] define identity theft as when personal details are stolen and identity fraud as when those details are used to commit fraud.

http://www.actionfraud.police.uk/fraud_protection/identity_f...

Re: Experian Sold Consumer Data to ID Theft Service

#35

Post by johnchristopher »

dangrossman wrote: post #31
johnchristopher wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why is the house "depreciated in value at all" ? I don't understand that part.

You just lived through a recession in which tens of millions of homes depreciated in value during the terms of their loans. Depreciated means it lost value; the house is worth less than before. That, combined with a small downpayment, can result in a bank holding a foreclosed home which is worth less than the value of the mortgage on it.

Ah, I see. I thought your explanation was more general, not specific to the current economic situation. And since I learned as a kid that a house normally only get more value over time (I live in western europe) that was confusing me. Thanks for the clarification.

Re: Experian Sold Consumer Data to ID Theft Service

#36

Post by GFischer »

troyk wrote: post #10
carbocation wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Going back a step, why should Experian have data on you?

And they can sell what they call the "header" of your credit report without regulation (such as the FCRA). This info includes your name, address, ssn and dob. Or at least it did when I bought it in the 90's to build a service to find dead-beat dads. I've heard they are more restrictive on the SSN, but I also would bet that's the #1 data element for the ID thefters.

I don't understand why the U.S. is so opposed to a nationwide ID, and yet obviously need one, and end up treating other documents less suited to the task as one.

Here in Uruguay (and almost everywhere else) we have a national ID number (Cédula de Identidad). It's not supposed to be secret (although it's not a great idea to divulge it freely).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_identification_number

Re: Experian Sold Consumer Data to ID Theft Service

#37

Post by Zenst »

icu wrote: post #22

Thanks cylo for the post. Sadly we can't seem to trust the credit agencies or Government agencies with data protection. We need a politician who will champion some sort of legal offence (Federal?) for digital data protection breaches whatever the industry/company (above anything that already exists) that will scare companies enough that they start taking digital identity seriously. Maybe that's a pipe dream but I get…

Agreed and I'm somewhat supprised (UK peep here) that no data protection act is in place. UK had first version of the act in 1984 (oh the ironic choice of dates, govermental humour maybe).

With that I'm amazzed there is nothing in the USA, must be something beyond class action suits?

Re: Experian Sold Consumer Data to ID Theft Service

#38

Post by ams6110 »

callmeed wrote: post #28
dangrossman wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Actual bad decisions you made in the past are a valid reason not to risk underwriting a large loan to you. There are valid criticisms of the credit agencies, but that doesn't seem like one of them. If you want a mortgage and you feel you have a convincing reason a bank should risk entrusting you with their money despite a bad credit history, try an in-person appointment with a lender at a local credit union. Be prepa…

I don't disagree with you–but it can be frustrating to know you've improved both your responsibility and your earning power yet only be judged by the past. For example, I've paid cash for the last 5 cars our family has purchased over the last 6 years. Why doesn't my ability to do that apply to my credit-worthiness? Small things like that annoy me about the agencies/system. Also, the median home price where we live is…

20% - 30% used to be the standard down payment for a mortgage. I'm not sure exactly when the %5%, 2%, and even no-money-down mortgages started, but they are a big part of why housing has been in such a mess the past decade. They sort of set the general expectation that you could buy a house with no personal sacrifice or investment, and thus made it easy for people to rationalize walking away when the payments became difficult to manage.

Re: Experian Sold Consumer Data to ID Theft Service

#39

Post by ams6110 »

callmeed wrote: post #27
malandrew wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I thought credit rating things only lasted 7 years. Are your credit transgressions more recent than that?

Most are, but (from what I understand) there are ways items can stay on for longer. For example, if your account is sold or resold to a collection agency, I believe the clock resets under the new creditor.

This is what bankruptcy is for. If you really get underwater you file bankruptcy, your debts are discharged by the court, you pay cash for seven years, and start over. Just informally leaving unpaid debts outstanding is not a good idea.

Re: Experian Sold Consumer Data to ID Theft Service

#40

Post by ams6110 »

Zenst wrote: post #37
icu wrote: post #22

Thanks cylo for the post. Sadly we can't seem to trust the credit agencies or Government agencies with data protection. We need a politician who will champion some sort of legal offence (Federal?) for digital data protection breaches whatever the industry/company (above anything that already exists) that will scare companies enough that they start taking digital identity seriously. Maybe that's a pipe dream but I get…

Agreed and I'm somewhat supprised (UK peep here) that no data protection act is in place. UK had first version of the act in 1984 (oh the ironic choice of dates, govermental humour maybe). With that I'm amazzed there is nothing in the USA, must be something beyond class action suits?

I think protecting data is a hopeless goal. The penalties need to be for fraud, and the responsibility for identity verification needs to be the creditors.

Hospital admissions and discharges used to be published every day in the paper. People used to have their social security number printed on their checks. Someone's birthday was a day of celebration, not a personal secret.

I want to get back to a place where routine facts about me do not need to be secret or something I worry about. The onus should be on anyone granting credit to verify that the person is who they claim to be, and it should take more than a few bits of public information to do that.

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