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Re: Beer

#111

Post by gknoy »

nilkn wrote: post #80
mgkimsal wrote: post #46

The beer culture is very very weird to me, and something I just don't get. I don't understand why companies don't promote an ice cream culture. Have custom flavors available throughout the day, a stocked freezer, etc. Sit back and have a sundae while discussing code problems. Try new toppings/sauces now and then, etc. I don't drink beer. When I was younger, it was mostly a financial issue. As I'm older, I just don't…

I also don't like the taste of beer and have never had a glass of beer I've really enjoyed. If I'm not careful, the aftertaste can actually gag me a little bit. I've had one or two unpleasant encounters with people who truly can't accept that all beer tastes bad to me. One person went so far as to tell me that you can't dislike beer if you like bread because, you know, beer is just liquid bread. I've since learned to…

Don't worry, I'm in a similar boat. I have disliked most beers that I've tried (exceptions: Guinness), and the alcohol that I do enjoy (e.g. scotch) I can really only enjoy about a sip. Or half a sip. Sometimes just the smell.

Bleh. I like that ice cream idea much better.

Re: Beer

#112

Post by drtse4 »

dfxm12 wrote: post #54
drtse4 wrote: post #15

Maybe it's because i'm european and not living in the US, but this kegerator in the office thing looks like something that gets old fast. The first weeks it may sound fun, beer in the office, branded beer glasses,etc... but i don't understand how someone could care as the novelty wears of. And i hope i don't need to comment on that "devs need beer" thing, c'mon, childish stuff. Does a subset of the employee likes bee…

It has nothing to do with being European. My (multinational) company has offices in the US and Belgium. There's beer on tap in Belgium, and not in the US. Every time I visit, my colleagues in Europe always make a big stink like "how do you get stuff done over there with no beer?"

Maybe in Belgium or in other countries with a "beer culture" like Germany, not hard to believe but not widespread anyway.

Just to add another data point, when i worked for an US multinational in Italy i clearly remember there was a rule against introducing alcoholics in the workplace, each place has its rules.

My point was just that in Europe drinking on the workplace isn't common or usually allowed and, at least from where i come from, i don't feel people in general are complaining about the lack of alcohol in the office. Finding beer and wine in the canteen, just for lunch, is instead quite common.

Re: Beer

#113

Post by mgkimsal »

lucisferre wrote: post #101
mgkimsal wrote: post #46

The beer culture is very very weird to me, and something I just don't get. I don't understand why companies don't promote an ice cream culture. Have custom flavors available throughout the day, a stocked freezer, etc. Sit back and have a sundae while discussing code problems. Try new toppings/sauces now and then, etc. I don't drink beer. When I was younger, it was mostly a financial issue. As I'm older, I just don't…

Why must these things be mutually exclusive. I enjoy good coffee, good beer (I brew as well and own a good coffee tools) good wine too. I love food and checking out new places around town. I can enjoy all of these things with colleagues and co-workers too, a number of whom don't drink, which is perfectly fine with me. Oddly enough I'm not into sweets so ice cream doesn't interest me (though a good gelato is pretty aw…

It's not something I face every day or all the time, but by comparison to regular every day life, around tech people and at tech events, it's more pronounced. And it may be a US thing, although I've got a German friend that constantly extols the virtue of fine German beers.

I'm fine with "to each his own", except... I'm not sure having kegs or company-provided beers in the office is an equal-footing sort of thing. Company-supplied alcohol is a tacit endorsement of that, and seems to foster a strange atmosphere at some companies.

Re: Beer

#114

Post by mgkimsal »

mathattack wrote: post #64
notdonspaulding wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

+1 for the proliferation of an ice cream culture.

I'm struggling enough with my weight. Give me a free ice cream culture and I'll be 150 kilos in no time! But seriously, I think this is a good idea as long as there are healthy alternatives.

Agreed, it wasn't so much a real suggestion - health issues are a concern with too much of anything.

I do wonder if there's an extra insurance companies would have to pay if the insurers were aware that alcohol was provided for free on their premises. I tried to have an alcohol at an event and had to get extra insurance, provide security, had hard limits on amounts, and a strict 1 hour time limit.

The moment some SV-tech hipster beer fan gets killed driving home, there's going to be a big public about face. Or maybe not, we seem to be able to sustain a female-hostile culture in the face of plenty of bad events continually cropping up. Maybe alcohol related deaths would be ignored too... ?

Re: Beer

#115

Post by davemel37 »

Zikes wrote: post #94

Everybody's talking about it as though everyone goes on a raging bender at work every evening. It's as though offices offered free cake and you're all imagining meeting rooms full of rotund programmers stuffing half a bundt down their gullet. If beer in an office is causing issues it's because someone doesn't know their limits, and that is an entirely individualized and likely very marginalized issue. The author's im…

I think her point is not "everyone goes on a raging bender" her point is more...if one person, one time, goes on a raging bender... was the tradeoff worth it. The answer of course is ABSOLUTELY NOT!!!

Culture decisions should be in the best interests of everyone in the office. If you have one recovering alcoholic in the office, or one person who might act irresponsibly...

This little harmless perk becomes a massive liability, and more importantly...is completely unnecessary and possibly inappropriate.

Re: Beer

#116

Post by bambax »

jiggy2011 wrote: post #110
bambax wrote: post #108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But beer, and people drinking beer and talking louder and louder as they drink, isn't distracting in a place of work?

You can drink a beer at your desk without being having to talk any louder or having to talk at all.

That's not the situation the parent is talking about.

Re: Beer

#117

Post by jiggy2011 »

bambax wrote: post #116
jiggy2011 wrote: post #110

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can drink a beer at your desk without being having to talk any louder or having to talk at all.

That's not the situation the parent is talking about.

If you mean tptacek's comment, I think that this is exactly the situation he is talking about.

Re: Beer

#118

Post by zacaltman »

bambax wrote: post #100
oh_sigh wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Like a lot of things, I think coffee is fine if you're adult about it. We've got quite a lot of coffee in our Chicago office... (I'm sorry, did I misquote your misquote?) Just because some things aren't fine if you're adult about it, doesn't make all things inappropriate at the office. Why would you have coffee in the office? What about all the people who can't drink coffee, because of their religious beliefs(Mormo…

> You seem to think that the only reason to drink beer is to get drunk. I'm not saying that and I'm not thinking that either. I don't like beer very much but I drink it occasionally. I prefer wine. > Are you really saying that it isn't possible to work after drinking one beer? Yes, I'm saying that, absolutely. You (I) can't do creative thinking (or any kind of thinking) after one glass of alcoholic beverage. > And ar…

Had to jump in here. Just because you have a person preference of complete sobriety whilst working shouldn't mean it's a policy for everyone.

For example: • I work best in the early mornings - does this mean everyone should come in from 5am? • I find it hard to work at a stand-up desk - nobody can use stand up desks anymore, sorry. • I feel drained after going to the gym before work - nobody can go to the gym before work, it will stifle your creative thinking. • Wearing long pants (versus shorts) makes me uncomfortable (i.e. unproductive) - no more long pants in the office.

If they make me unproductive - fine. That's me. As for making it a company issue - tell me which of the above options go beyond personal preference.

Re: Beer

#119

Post by mooreds »

I think that there are two ideas worth separating in this post.

1. Having ready beer (a keg) available in a work setting can cause issues. Ready alcohol impairs judgement and blurs boundaries.

2. Having Friday afternoon beers (or any other kind of gathering) can be beneficial to company bonding and communication. Frankly, I don't care if it is ice cream (as suggested in the comments), beer, weekly lunches, or kite flying--I want a regular low pressure social atmosphere for a) getting to know my team mates and b) exchanging work ideas in an informal cross department setting.

I think having types of events outlined in point 2 is beneficial to everyone in the company.

Disclaimer--I work in a small company that does Friday afternoon beers, but we are not a startup.

Re: Beer

#120

Post by zacaltman »

davemel37 wrote: post #115
Zikes wrote: post #94

Everybody's talking about it as though everyone goes on a raging bender at work every evening. It's as though offices offered free cake and you're all imagining meeting rooms full of rotund programmers stuffing half a bundt down their gullet. If beer in an office is causing issues it's because someone doesn't know their limits, and that is an entirely individualized and likely very marginalized issue. The author's im…

I think her point is not "everyone goes on a raging bender" her point is more...if one person, one time, goes on a raging bender... was the tradeoff worth it. The answer of course is ABSOLUTELY NOT!!! Culture decisions should be in the best interests of everyone in the office. If you have one recovering alcoholic in the office, or one person who might act irresponsibly... This little harmless perk becomes a massive l…

Interesting aspect i'd never thought of. When you haven't working in (or with) HR before I guess you might not think of things like recovering alcoholics - or even company liability.

It seems a lot of startups ignore these issues for a hope of garnering another scoop from the talent pool.

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