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I got hired at a Bangladesh sweatshop. Meet my 9-year-old boss [video]

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Re: I got hired at a Bangladesh sweatshop. Meet my 9-year-old boss [video]

#141

Post by solistice »

lmm wrote: post #120
factorizer wrote: post #101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A first, rather easy solution would be to pay decently. What? Capitalists can't do this? Because other capitalists will drive them out of business? My my, isn't the system really fucked! Time for some radical architectural changes.

> Capitalists can't do this? Because other capitalists will drive them out of business? My my, isn't the system really fucked! Time for some radical architectural changes. Been tried. Didn't work out very well.

Meh, Communism is like Zero-Point Energy. It sounds good in theory, but it's been disproved time after time, yet it still has adherents saying that the conventional power grid is evil, and that Zero-Point Energy will solve everything.

I'm waiting for someone to tell me that Communism works, but that people are broken, the most marvelous rationalization that history ever spit forth.

Re: I got hired at a Bangladesh sweatshop. Meet my 9-year-old boss [video]

#142

Post by ericd »

kansface wrote: post #113
ericd wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not that simple. If you pay more than the next factory over for the same work, you become uncompetitive with that factory, and you start losing contracts. If that becomes bad enough, that will drive you under. This is why minimum wages are important - to make it so your neighbor also has to pay the better rate as well. This breaks down somewhat when your factory is competing with another factory in another count…

Moreover, if they did implement a minimum wage, business would just move to the next country that doesn't

Yeah, I didn't explain very well, but that's what I meant by needing a world government with a strong rule of law - the minimum wage would need to be implemented across the board, or it just ends up screwing people in the country that implemented it.

Re: I got hired at a Bangladesh sweatshop. Meet my 9-year-old boss [video]

#143

Post by jdotjdot »

javajosh wrote: post #129
jdotjdot wrote: post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can't decide how I feel about this. On the one hand, I love the initiative you're taking here and the drive you have. Reading the article, my immediate thought was "that's terrible"--whereas yours was "What can I personally do about this right now?" On the other hand, I remain unconvinced that directing resources simply to the people and charities that come my way through the media is the best way to distribute the…

I probably would have felt the same way as you even a year ago. But then it started to feel like I was always waiting to be "effective" and never actually doing anything. If every human on this planet who could just adopted one other random person on this planet to look out for, wouldn't the world be a much better place?

Possibly, except my point was Meem is hardly random. If everyone took that initiative, Meem would get a ton of support because of the publicity--but no one else would.

Re: I got hired at a Bangladesh sweatshop. Meet my 9-year-old boss [video]

#144

Post by L_Rahman »

wildgift wrote: post #121
L_Rahman wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> any quietly upvoted defense of child labor sounds like "the slaves had it better than in _x_" or "women were spared _y_" jobs to me when it comes to defending poor social policy.  Grown-ass white men getting paid to develop digital toys justifying to themselves why the situation for 9 year old sweatshop workers is good enough. JFC. I'm not defending this situation at all. It is unforgivable that factory owners soc…

I wouldn't be surprised if the regulations exist but aren't enforced. What these workers need is power to enforce the laws... and in the absence of adequate laws, to marshal enough popular force to create agreements that are better than what laws might exist. As first-worlders, it's our moral duty to support people who work to help create that power for the factory workers.

While the regulations that do exist are weak, they are an improvement over existing conditions. What's saddening is that there have even been a number of cases where the engineers in regulatory agencies have gone into factories and reported structural failures and fire code violations to their superiors only to have it completely shut down.

In most cases in Bangladesh corruption occurs at the inspection level with relatively low-level individuals. That the factory owners have been able to buy out the higher level officials that the inspecting teams report to is troubling and has me worried.

Re: I got hired at a Bangladesh sweatshop. Meet my 9-year-old boss [video]

#145

Post by simplefish »

RodericDay wrote: post #24
L_Rahman wrote: post #16

As someone who's spent his life roughly equally split across Bangladesh and America, I thought I'd provide some perspective. The questions I ask myself about this situation are: 1. Are the lives of the people who work in these factories better or worse as a result of these jobs existing? The answer I end up arriving at repeatedly is that it is a resounding improvement in the lives of almost everyone. RMG factories em…

The way I answer people that say this is: It's not good enough. Yes, you can come up with all the explanation whatsoever you want to how this is a ~local maxima~ of happiness, but the fact is that we live on a much higher one with tons of disposable income and benefit from their work... so it s not a ~global maxima~ (not even close) so we should do better. What can I say? I'm definitely more to the left than most peo…

It's easy to stand on the sidelines and hurl brickbats at a system (global capitalism) which has raised more people out of grinding poverty in a shorter time than everything else we've ever done in all of recorded history combined.

It's harder to offer real suggestions to actually improve the lives of the poor. And I see you don't.

Your outrage may make you feel good, but it helps no one but you. And that makes it selfish.

Re: I got hired at a Bangladesh sweatshop. Meet my 9-year-old boss [video]

#146

Post by Natsu »

Retric wrote: post #71
Natsu wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Have you ever worked in a factory? I used to. They squeeze you as hard as they can, constantly. Most of the people have no leverage to push back. While having money is better than having none, that doesn't mean everything is ok and you can just ignore the way the workers get abused. In the US, you can push back at things like unsafe conditions with threats of OSHA. I doubt there's any such thing in Bangladesh, but it…

The #1 way to fight back is to quit which increases costs to the factory owner, if you don't then it's better than the alternatives.

I've seen constant double-digit monthly turnover and that didn't do much that I could discern. Yes, it raised costs but they were relatively insensitive to that.

Re: I got hired at a Bangladesh sweatshop. Meet my 9-year-old boss [video]

#147

Post by wickerdog »

We spend more time talking about these issues than doing something about it. Just STOP buying anything that says 'Made in China/Bangladesh/Pakistan, etc.

But you might say, 'then those workers will not even get the few dollars they get now.'

NO.

Throw money out of the equation. Everything will set itself right.

Re: I got hired at a Bangladesh sweatshop. Meet my 9-year-old boss [video]

#149

Post by unlogic »

lemmsjid wrote: post #109
cglee wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

slacktivism ... maybe angry slacktivism

I really detest that term. The implication is that if you aren't out there doing something then you should just shut up and not be upset. To me that flies in the face of democracy and public discourse--words and opinions do matter. If someone who is outraged but doesn't do anything is a 'slacktivist', then what is someone who is both not outraged and not doing anything about it? The implication of 'slacktivist' is th…

if you aren't out there doing something then you should just shut up

You've said it yourself. Golden words.

What kind of democracy do you expect to get in HN comments? After that half-cocked "outrage" and "being upset" the slacktivist is going to click another cat video startup and forget this topic altogether. I can see dêmos, but κράτος - not at all.

Re: I got hired at a Bangladesh sweatshop. Meet my 9-year-old boss [video]

#150

Post by rehack »

RodericDay wrote: post #24
L_Rahman wrote: post #16

As someone who's spent his life roughly equally split across Bangladesh and America, I thought I'd provide some perspective. The questions I ask myself about this situation are: 1. Are the lives of the people who work in these factories better or worse as a result of these jobs existing? The answer I end up arriving at repeatedly is that it is a resounding improvement in the lives of almost everyone. RMG factories em…

The way I answer people that say this is: It's not good enough. Yes, you can come up with all the explanation whatsoever you want to how this is a ~local maxima~ of happiness, but the fact is that we live on a much higher one with tons of disposable income and benefit from their work... so it s not a ~global maxima~ (not even close) so we should do better. What can I say? I'm definitely more to the left than most peo…

I am with you mate, on this one. Only if one develops a sense of revulsion, when reading poor little Meem's story, can one contribute to bring about change.

Others like your parent mean well. But that kind of thinking leads to quiet apathy, in my opinion. So what if Meem and other women are better off, than previous generation. Clearly this is not enough. Come on man! A 9 year old (or whatever age) not knowing there are other things that are possible, working 9 to 9 and just getting half a day off on Fridays. Is this the best life, she can have? Seriously people, there is something wrong with your thinking on this. You are not being ambitious enough, and settling for very low level of results. Again the last few sentences are not for you, RodericDay, but for all those who are countering you with their pragmatism and level-headedness.

Lincoln, when he fought for abolishing slavery, also would have faced such reactions. (And to all others, my intent is not to directly put this commenter alongside Lincoln. Its just to make a point, to recognize this as a valid sentiment)

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