How Harvey Mudd Transformed Its CS Program And Nearly Closed Its Gender Gap

51–52 of 52 posts

Re: How Harvey Mudd Transformed Its CS Program And Nearly Closed Its Gender Gap

#51

Post by davorak » Sat, Oct 12, 2013, 2:21 AM UTC

codexon wrote: post #50

davorak wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I don't know why you assume that 50/50 is the desired ratio when acceptance is supposed to be self-selected and merit based. I was not trying to communicate my desire. Rather what is optimal? I need strong evidence to operate far from 50/50. > Specifically this quote. This counts as evidence, but not enough evidence to get me to think the optimum is close to having 14-18% female CS degree recipients(2010). Nice gra…

You prefer 50/50 but you have no evidence to even suggest that this is the "best" distribution for CS let alone any other major. Why can't you accept the possibility that females do not like CS as much as males do not like things like nursing or human resources? If there is a social stigma, should we really force people who normally wouldn't choose it so we can have a 50/50 ratio just because that is the probability…

> You prefer 50/50 but you have no evidence to even suggest that this is the "best" distribution for CS let alone any other major.

50/50 is the default with out additional information. Again I am not trying to statement my preferences.

> Why can't you accept the possibility that females do not like CS as much as males do not like things like nursing or human resources?

I did not say I can not. Like any idea I want good evidence and solid understanding to make strong claims.

> If there is a social stigma, should we really force people who normally wouldn't choose it so we can have a 50/50 ratio just because that is the probability to be born as?

I have not seen anyone make the argument to force people to take CS courses.

> Who are you to say that they are happier doing CS instead of what they would've chosen without all this influence?

Trying is better then not trying. Influence exist weather intentional or not. Unintentional influences are not inherently better then intentional.

Re: How Harvey Mudd Transformed Its CS Program And Nearly Closed Its Gender Gap

#52

Post by davorak » Sat, Oct 12, 2013, 2:51 AM UTC

codexon wrote: post #49

davorak wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. The burden of proof lies with you, not with me. You will have to explain what claim you find extraordinary and what specific evidence you would find convincing for me to consider doing research to provide some. > This is not complex at all. I did not call it complex. You made an argument by occam's razor if details are added to the argument to make it viable it m…

I already repeated multiple times what claim I find ordinary: that Mudd is somehow able to retain so many female CS majors simply by accepting more. It is up to you to prove that they are able to do this otherwise. > You made an argument by occam's razor if details are added to the argument to make it viable it make it more complex and it benefits less from occam's razor. My argument or your added details I only expl…

> I already repeated multiple times what claim I find ordinary: that Mudd is somehow able to retain so many female CS majors simply by accepting more. It is up to you to prove that they are able to do this otherwise.

State your prediction for the female population by year dependent on initial enrollment percentage and I will consider do some hard research and bring it back.

> I did not add any details the argument, merely to reinforce the fact that my argument stems from common sense

Occam's razor argument is usually only effective if their is a obvious difference in the complexity of the two arguments. The details are often needed to establish weather or not their is a significant complexity difference.

> yours appears to make wild conjectures on how Harvey Mudd is better than every other CS department.

Is their a particular claim you are referencing? I try to stay away from making wild conjectures.

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