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David Byrne: If the 1% stifles New York's creative talent, I'm out of here

theguardian.com

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Re: David Byrne: If the 1% stifles New York's creative talent, I'm out of here

#41

Post by busterarm »

so_says wrote: post #6

Towards the end of the article, Mr. Bryne touches on a topic that is at the heart of a city devoid of culture --- people who buy large swaths of property and then do not live here. We don't need rent control, but we do need to build affordable housing instead of luxury condo after luxury condo for people to use a few weeks out of the year. The least expensive average rental price for a studio is $1481/month. Landlord…

I really think that New York City needs to institute _massive_ tax penalties for people who don't reside in their apartments as a primary residence. I know that our property taxes are already high, but just about everywhere else has big incentives for residing in your property.

There's a lot of apartments in manhattan that are only lived in ~4 weeks a year and aren't rented out otherwise. I wouldn't be opposed to a higher tax rate for those properties. They're effectively jacking up other people's rents and making them have to commute from farther away.

Re: David Byrne: If the 1% stifles New York's creative talent, I'm out of here

#42

Post by badman_ting »

nostromo wrote: post #36

I think New York should welcome the uber-rich with open arms. NY's history is all about 1%ers, like Vanderbilt and Rockefeller and Bloomberg. But what is deleterious to the feel of the city, in my view, is the Dubai-ization of the real-estate market. Entire buildings are empty. Apparently the global elite buy and sell New York real-estate like they do oil futures: not to use but as an investment. These folks aren't c…

> I think New York should welcome the uber-rich with open arms.

> But what is deleterious to the feel of the city, in my view, is the Dubai-ization of the real estate market.

OK, but that's being done by rich people buying properties as investments.

Re: David Byrne: If the 1% stifles New York's creative talent, I'm out of here

#43

Post by Pxtl »

MrZongle2 wrote: post #38
Pxtl wrote: post #31

The only way to fix the crazy housing market of NYC is to make more places like NYC. As long as NYC remains a completely unique singular jewel of successful urban living while the rest of the country embraces suburban sprawl and terrible transit, NYC will remain almost comedically expensive.

Causing a problem to spread to more areas so the original area's problem isn't as bad relatively isn't a solution. That's madness.

When the problem is caused by a shortage of supply (prestigious NYC housing) compared to the crazy-high demand? Then yes, more supply is a solution.

Re: David Byrne: If the 1% stifles New York's creative talent, I'm out of here

#44

Post by busterarm »

rayiner wrote: post #40
busterarm wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you own a car? How difficult is it to live where you do without a car? I was mostly speaking about the areas near the train station that you mentioned yeah. Those prices are pretty high for the commute time that you end up having. A 15 minute walk is okay but any longer than that might be very difficult for some people.

The apartments right by the train stations are artificially expensive. They're designed to take advantage of the fact that white commuters don't want to risk living in a building with low income minorities. The surrounding housing is half the price, and the area is quite safe. Nearly all of the Westchester suburbs are extremely walkable. All of the essential stuff is on the train line. The wife and I would load up th…

I haven't been back there recently enough to know if MN is 24 hours but I recall travel being limited to certain times and this is especially true on the LIRR. Especially late at night, the train is filled with annoying rowdy drunks. That's more than enough reason for me not to want to live out there. It's like being deprived of all of the social benefits of living in/around NYC.

I mean, I totally get what you're saying, but I didn't find much benefit to living out there. I don't have a family though.

Re: David Byrne: If the 1% stifles New York's creative talent, I'm out of here

#45

Post by jlgreco »

MrZongle2 wrote: post #38
Pxtl wrote: post #31

The only way to fix the crazy housing market of NYC is to make more places like NYC. As long as NYC remains a completely unique singular jewel of successful urban living while the rest of the country embraces suburban sprawl and terrible transit, NYC will remain almost comedically expensive.

Causing a problem to spread to more areas so the original area's problem isn't as bad relatively isn't a solution. That's madness.

Being a desirable place to live isn't a "problem" it is a feature.

Being the only desirable place to live might be problematic to some people who want to live in that desirable place cheaply, but the solution to that is not to tear down the desirable place to the same level as other cities, "Harrison Bergeron" style.

Re: David Byrne: If the 1% stifles New York's creative talent, I'm out of here

#46

Post by saidajigumi »

gaius wrote: post #30

Has there ever been a time without massive inequality in NYC? It's been a standard theme in TV and films for as long as I can remember that Manhattan is stunning wealth right next to Harlem's grinding poverty. Look at Eddie Murphy films from the 80s, Coming To America, Trading Places, etc. What's different now?

There's a vast difference between an NYC that has massive inequality and the NYC that's being created today -- one where gentrification that squeezes out not just "crime" but anyone below an upper class income status. That's the trend and future that Byrne describes:

> If we look at the city as it is now, then we would have to say that it looks a lot like the divided city that presumptive mayor Bill de Blasio has been harping about: most of Manhattan and many parts of Brooklyn are virtual walled communities, pleasure domes for the rich (which, full disclosure, includes me), and aside from those of us who managed years ago to find our niche and some means of income, there is no room for fresh creative types. Middle-class people can barely afford to live here anymore, so forget about emerging artists, musicians, actors, dancers, writers, journalists and small business people. Bit by bit, the resources that keep the city vibrant are being eliminated.

He goes on to describe a number of elements that contribute to these trends:

> The talent pool became a limited resource for any industry, except Wall Street. [...] any businesses that might have employed creative individuals were having difficulties surviving, and naturally, the arty types had a hard time finding employment, too.

Environment drives out creatives -> creative industries have hard time hiring (start moving elsewhere) -> Environment gets even worse for creatives.

Re: David Byrne: If the 1% stifles New York's creative talent, I'm out of here

#47

Post by busterarm »

Pxtl wrote: post #34
busterarm wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Toronto has a really interesting problem to solve. 1/6 of the entire population of Canada lives in the GTA. That's simply stunning to me, especially since having spent a great deal of time up there, it doesn't feel that dense to me. Honestly though, Toronto needs housing in the downtown areas. I haven't been there in 7-8 years but other than tourists and shopping, the streets around the business districts felt pretty…

The problem is that the GTA sports some of the worst urban planning on the continent. The simple fact is that while Downtown Toronto is wonderful, there just isn't enough Downtown Toronto to go around and you quickly get into inefficient sprawl. And then it's an ocean of Mississaugaism for 50km in every direction. It's gotten bad enough that poor artsy Torontonians have started moving here to Hamilton . They're so de…

I like Hamilton, despite the industrial smells. Heh. I spent quite a lot of time around there and Burlington and I much prefer that side of the GTA to the eastern side.

The GO train commute isn't that bad...90 minutes at the most and it's pretty direct.

Re: David Byrne: If the 1% stifles New York's creative talent, I'm out of here

#48

Post by a8da6b0c91d »

gaius wrote: post #30

Has there ever been a time without massive inequality in NYC? It's been a standard theme in TV and films for as long as I can remember that Manhattan is stunning wealth right next to Harlem's grinding poverty. Look at Eddie Murphy films from the 80s, Coming To America, Trading Places, etc. What's different now?

Trading Places was set in Philadelphia for some strange reason.

Re: David Byrne: If the 1% stifles New York's creative talent, I'm out of here

#49

Post by bradleyjg »

Queens is still here and as ethnically diverse as ever. The Bronx, Staten Island, Brooklyn West and South, and Manhattan North of 110 Street are all places where people live. You don't see many pied-à-terres on Grand Concourse.

These complaints are from one warring faction of the wealthy. One faction wants total isolation in their neighborhoods and the other wants a sprinkle of the right kind of poor person as scenery. To me it's an irrelevant debate. I couldn't possibly care any less whether young bankers or young artists dominate the East Village.

Let them have their whole foods and their dog walkers and their prestigious addresses. We have an income tax -- they are contributing tax money for the rest of us. Even the absentees are paying property taxes while not consuming any services.

All of this strikes me as the rich complaining about the richer, while trying to couch their complaints in populist rhetoric.

Re: David Byrne: If the 1% stifles New York's creative talent, I'm out of here

#50

Post by dev_jim »

gaius wrote: post #30

Has there ever been a time without massive inequality in NYC? It's been a standard theme in TV and films for as long as I can remember that Manhattan is stunning wealth right next to Harlem's grinding poverty. Look at Eddie Murphy films from the 80s, Coming To America, Trading Places, etc. What's different now?

Those movies were addressing a contemporary phenomenon when inequality took off again after being relatively dormant since the 1920's. A combination of deregulation, a reduction in top tax rate, and demand for all kinds of debt caused an explosion of wealth on Wall Street. Meanwhile the rest of city was still recovering from being bankrupt in the 70s.
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