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Federal Government Begins First Shutdown In 17 Years

forbes.com

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Re: Federal Government Begins First Shutdown In 17 Years

#61

Post by throwaway420 »

vacri wrote: post #40
throwaway420 wrote: post #11

I really hate that the media has labeled this a government shut down. Is the NSA going to stop spying on us? Are they still printing money? Are corporate subsidies still proceeding as normal? Will they stop taxing us? Will they stop giving out checks to the military industrial complex? Will they stop military attacks? Will we still be felt up at airports? Are they still going to throw people behind bars for illegal p…

Will they stop taxing us? Taxes are not evil, bad, or wrong. Excessive taxes are something you can argue about, but the mere existence of them is not evidence of evil.

Thanks for clarifying for me what opinions I'm allowed to have.

Re: Federal Government Begins First Shutdown In 17 Years

#62

Post by ars »

It seems to me that if it was illegal to combine unrelated subject into a single vote/bill government would run much smoother.

No "pork" or pet projects (you'd have to vote separately on each). You could add ACA provisions to this government spending bill since they are unrelated, so there would be no shutdown.

Since it's hard to define "unrelated" make it so that if 1/3 of the members vote that it's unrelated, then it's unrelated and has to voted on separately.

Re: Federal Government Begins First Shutdown In 17 Years

#63

Post by ewoodrich »

throwaway420 wrote: post #11

I really hate that the media has labeled this a government shut down. Is the NSA going to stop spying on us? Are they still printing money? Are corporate subsidies still proceeding as normal? Will they stop taxing us? Will they stop giving out checks to the military industrial complex? Will they stop military attacks? Will we still be felt up at airports? Are they still going to throw people behind bars for illegal p…

I'm sure that the 98% of NASA staff that will be furloughed will consider it to be shutdown.

Re: Federal Government Begins First Shutdown In 17 Years

#66

Post by icambron »

chaz wrote: post #48
rhelmer wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not sure who counts as "military industrial complex", but the Pentagon has already said that troops will not be paid: http://www.google.com/hostednews/afp/article/ALeqM5gC5rwPOPz...

Hours before the shutdown, Obama signed a bill that granted an exception to the military, ensuring it will continue to operate and troops will be paid: http://www.politico.com/story/2013/09/government-shutdown-se...

Which is also in the article:

>But 1.4 million uniformed members of the military will stay on the job and will be paid, thanks to a last-minute bill unanimously passed by both houses and signed by Obama on Monday night.

Which goes to show that no matter how dysfunctional our government becomes it will go to any length to ensure that it's still capable of killing lots of people.

Re: Federal Government Begins First Shutdown In 17 Years

#67

Post by cantrevealname »

gizmo686 wrote: post #33
nostromo wrote: post #24

We all spend so much time focusing on the Federal Government but I doubt many of us will even notice the "shut down." Compare that with what would happen if your local and state governments shut down: Trash would pile up. Criminals would run free in the streets. Fires wouldn't be put out. Water and electricity would stop. Sewage systems would back up. Schools would close. We're talking about services that are the ver…

Some people actually get paid by the federal government. When these people don't get paid, they are much less likely to spend money, hurting non-government businesses. And the parts of the government that are shutting down also won't be consuming from private business either, again hurting business and the economy.

Your making the broken window fallacy:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parable_of_the_broken_window

If we didn't have these unwanted government services (or wanted services provided very poorly or at excessive cost), then the taxpayers would spent their money on something else -- something that is wanted -- and it would generate just as many jobs or economic activity in some other way.

Re: Federal Government Begins First Shutdown In 17 Years

#68

Post by ars »

icambron wrote: post #50
selmnoo wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is worth noting, incidentally, that the DoD is the largest employer in the world: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_largest_employers

Which I think says something very sad about our national priorities.

That we prioritize jobs?

The DOD is a jobs program, with a side benefit of being a military. But mainly it's a jobs program that also does basic research and engineering.

Re: Federal Government Begins First Shutdown In 17 Years

#69

Post by ThomPete »

throwaway420 wrote: post #61
vacri wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Will they stop taxing us? Taxes are not evil, bad, or wrong. Excessive taxes are something you can argue about, but the mere existence of them is not evidence of evil.

Thanks for clarifying for me what opinions I'm allowed to have.

Claiming that taxes are evil or good is hardly HN material. You are entitled to your opinion but please focus on factual matters, not just opinion pieces. I am sure we all have ours.
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