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Steam Controller

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Re: Steam Controller

#181

Post by thenonsequitur »

methodin wrote: post #148
thenonsequitur wrote: post #128

I think it's great that Valve is innovating on controllers. Personally, I won't buy one -- I don't intend on getting a steam machine so I'd only be using it with my computer anyway, and I don't think this will ever beat a keyboard/mouse in terms of practicality and ease of use. But that aside, I'm glad they are at least trying to make a next-generation controller -- gives me hope there might one day be a controller I…

Keyboard and mouse is terrible for sitting in front of a tv, so in that regard, this is compelling enough for me to play games while not sitting in a secluded office room desk hah

Yeah, I agree with you. I should have qualified what I said. I meant to say, "I'd only be using it with my computer anyway, and I don't think this will ever beat a keyboard/mouse in terms of practicality and ease of use with a computer". Agree that for a tv in the living room, or any environment where a large flat surface in front of you is impractical, that a keyboard/mouse is not so good.

Re: Steam Controller

#182

Post by Pxtl »

hackula1 wrote: post #175
blktiger wrote: post #156

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It sounds to me like you would be able to use the trackpad regions as either "joysticks" or "trackpads" which means for an RTS game you would be no worse off than using a trackpad over a mouse. Other games might be better using them as joysticks where the input re-centers if you lift up from the control surface. Seems like a pretty big improvement over traditional controllers without any significant downsides.

> which means for an RTS game you would be no worse off than using a trackpad over a mouse. Just about anyone who plays RTSs would agree that trackpads are completely unacceptable for input. For a game like SC2, you might as well not even play, because you would be lose so badly at against anyone at a similar skill level.

I figure they're trying to be optimistc about it... it might not measure up to a mouse, of course, but either way it's a huge improvement. This device will get you from "this is completely unplayable" to "hey I can get through the single-player campaign and maybe do some co-op comp-stomping with my buds"

Re: Steam Controller

#183

Post by mikelat »

jiggy2011 wrote: post #72
mikelat wrote: post #47

Call me impressed. I never thought that the biggest innovator and risk taker in the console market would be valve. All the other manufacturers have basically made their platforms "safe" and they're pretty much like the last generation, but this is pretty ballsy from valve.

They're in a better position to try it. If Sony released an unpopular controller with their new console it could cost them billions in console sales. If this doesn't work, valve can forget about it and move on HL3.

Nintendo took a big risk for the Wii and reaped the rewards. From a consumer standpoint I want to see progress and change, that's what interests me. A lot of gaming these days seems to be taking the less risky route of making endless sequels and never mixing anything up as not to upset their core audience who apparently hates change.

Re: Steam Controller

#184

Post by deletes »

paulgerhardt wrote: post #170

I got to hold one of these a few months ago. It's solid. The ergonomics are there. The same designer[1] was previously at {one of the other three very large gaming console manufacturers} and knows a thing or two about controllers. My understanding is it will be significantly more accurate than traditional joysticks and competitive with a mouse (with a mouse you have a single 'large' plane of motion, with this, you ha…

What do you mean by having an extra plane. The mouse already covers a 2d surface, how would an extra plane help you with that?

The analog trackpad does have an advantage over a keyboard but not over a mouse, i think.

Re: Steam Controller

#185

Post by mikelat »

Osiris wrote: post #55
mikelat wrote: post #47

Call me impressed. I never thought that the biggest innovator and risk taker in the console market would be valve. All the other manufacturers have basically made their platforms "safe" and they're pretty much like the last generation, but this is pretty ballsy from valve.

Speaking on innovation, the Xbox 360 came out with a brand new controller, but the Xbox One has practically the same controller? It's like they didn't take any time to re-evaluate the controller with the new console. For that matter, the PS4 controller is the same except with a small touchpad in the middle.

They were busy trying to shift to a closed digital distribution platform, which gamers hanged them for. Granted their intentions were for their own profit margins and not at all for the consumer in mind, but things like that probably make them less likely to take risks in the future.

Re: Steam Controller

#186

Post by mbrubeck »

deletes wrote: post #184
paulgerhardt wrote: post #170

I got to hold one of these a few months ago. It's solid. The ergonomics are there. The same designer[1] was previously at {one of the other three very large gaming console manufacturers} and knows a thing or two about controllers. My understanding is it will be significantly more accurate than traditional joysticks and competitive with a mouse (with a mouse you have a single 'large' plane of motion, with this, you ha…

What do you mean by having an extra plane. The mouse already covers a 2d surface, how would an extra plane help you with that? The analog trackpad does have an advantage over a keyboard but not over a mouse, i think.

In a typical keyboard+mouse FPS game, for example, you get 2D analog "look" controls with the mouse, but much more limited 2D "move" controls with the keyboard.

With two analog sticks/trackpads/mice/etc. you can get the same range of control over both. That's what the two "planes" give you.

Re: Steam Controller

#187

Post by nilkn »

romaniv wrote: post #154

While this might be a good replacement for console controllers, I seriously doubt that it will be successful in replacing keyboard and mouse for FPSes, RTSes, point-and-click adventures and other genres that currently make PC game market interesting . Which makes me sad. Valve is effectively turning its back on the games (and gamers) that allowed it succeed despite competition from consoles. Personally, I am keenly i…

> Valve is effectively turning its back on the games (and gamers) that allowed it succeed despite competition from consoles.

I don't see how they are turning their backs on anyone just because they're venturing into a new market segment.

The current system, where people have both gaming PCs and separate gaming consoles, doesn't make a modicum of sense practically. It's just a vestige of old monopolies and corporate competitions which led to this state. Ideally, one could just have a gaming machine with less of a distinction between whether it's a "PC" or a "console".

> I'm not at all interested in yet another game console with limited controls, centralized publisher model and locked down OS.

I thought one of the points of the Steam machines is that they're not locked down at all.

Re: Steam Controller

#188

Post by alexeisadeski3 »

Why not just use a mouse+kb?

I've been living room gaming w/wireless mouse+kb for years and years now. No problems at all doing this from the couch. Kb in your lap, mouse by your side with a hard metal mousepad.

Re: Steam Controller

#189

Post by djcary »

ZoFreX wrote: post #176
djcary wrote: post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was a bit disappointed until I read the bit about hardware hack-ability. Accessibility in games is an oft ignored topic. The open nature of these controllers will hopefully lead to more games being playable by disabled gamers as people extend the hardware. Of course, the flip side of that coin is people modifying the controller to gain an unfair advantage.

> Of course, the flip side of that coin is people modifying the controller to gain an unfair advantage. Nothing stopping the community doing the same thing and sharing the results with everyone, though!

Very true! When it releases, I may try to use data from an Eye Tribe (http://theeyetribe.com/) to drive the right trackpad output. The added cost seems like a valid deterrent against people just trying to cheat, and a bearable cost for someone who wants to play games but is incapable of using a traditional controller.

Re: Steam Controller

#190

Post by slantyyz »

joenathan wrote: post #169
Arjuna wrote: post #124

"Steam gamers, who are used to the input associated with PCs, will appreciate that the Steam Controller's resolution approaches that of a desktop mouse." [...] "The Steam Controller is built around a new generation of super-precise haptic feedback, employing dual linear resonant actuators. These small, strong, weighted electro-magnets are attached to each of the dual trackpads." Wow. It sounds as though they have man…

How would one play something like Street Fighter with this controller, the button placement seems like it wouldn't allow for a good experience with fighters or even platformers.

Yeah, this controller is definitely for "PC type" gamers.

Most fighting gamers prefer to use wired USB fighting sticks anyways, and given that those sticks tend to work out of the box on most operating systems, I would expect them to work on the Steam Machines too.

IIRC, Steam only really has three modern fighting games (SFIV:AE2012, SF vs Tekken and KoF13) -- I don't know that Capcom or SNK would plan to port those Windows games over to Linux anyways -- you'd likely have to play them streamed, and I'm not sure that any serious fighting gamer would want to do that.

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