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A bachelor’s degree could cost $10,000 total. Here’s how

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Re: A bachelor’s degree could cost $10,000 total. Here’s how

#21

Post by OldSchool »

$10K Isn't too far off from what tuition for my EE degree cost in the late 80's. Even adjusted for real inflation it shouldn't be a penny more than $20K, possibly as low as about $15K today. That was of course at a state school.

The somewhat counter-intuitive answer is that easy money has increased the price of education, in this case easy borrowing.

The same phenomenon is responsible for almost all bubbles in modern history. Interest rates dropped and qualification criteria got loose and house prices tripled in some areas, also rising in almost all. VC's got sloppy and we had the dot-com bubble.

The serious problem facing America today is that easy money is already flowing yet this bubble is also called "barely getting by as a nation."

Re: A bachelor’s degree could cost $10,000 total. Here’s how

#22

Post by lelandbatey »

mrxd wrote: post #15

Is there any data showing that the cost of college is increasing? I know the price (i.e. tuition) is increasing, but this is due to colleges increasing tuition rates to make up for shortfalls as state budgets for higher education are cut. But I haven't seen any data showing that the costs have risen. It's also worth noting that the #2 suggestion is mostly just an accounting trick that would increase the price to stud…

I've got absolutely no data to support this, so make no mistake that this is anything other than the wildest speculation:

The feeling that's "in the air" is that what's really happened is buildup of too much management in the school systems. There seem to be far more "managers" per professor than there were before, and those managers are being paid far to much, especially in comparison to the professors doing the actual teaching.

It's pretty classic: most large-ish universities have marketing departments (or hire marketing departments), large non-educational functions and services that take up tremendous man power, overly large "cultural" aspects like sports, and many more.

The cost of educating hasn't really changed, but that's not what most universities are focused on doing anymore.

Re: A bachelor’s degree could cost $10,000 total. Here’s how

#23

Post by bane »

willchilcutt wrote: post #14

How about go to an in-state school, get a scholarship (many go unclaimed every year), and get an on campus job? I, along with many people I know, got paid to go to school this way. Why people are paying tens of thousands of dollars a year/semester is beyond me.

Taking it further, do you first two years at a community college then transfer 100% of your credits to the local state school and start there as a Junior.

Re: A bachelor’s degree could cost $10,000 total. Here’s how

#24

Post by willchilcutt »

Romoku wrote: post #18
willchilcutt wrote: post #14

How about go to an in-state school, get a scholarship (many go unclaimed every year), and get an on campus job? I, along with many people I know, got paid to go to school this way. Why people are paying tens of thousands of dollars a year/semester is beyond me.

I never got the whole scholarship thing. All of the websites that advertise them sound like scams. I'd prefer to get an online bachelor's degree if they existed.

Most schools have lists of scholarships that are applicable to the school. No need to go to third party websites.

Re: A bachelor’s degree could cost $10,000 total. Here’s how

#25

Post by L_Rahman »

ballard wrote: post #16

Or $0, if the sheepskin, corrected homework and grades won't matter. Audit classes at the large institution of your choice means just sitting in on whatever lectures you like. In big lecture halls, even with attendance, it's really quite simple to go unnoticed. Interactive classes JD/MBA might get dicey, but otherwise the worst that can happen is you get thrown out. BFD. Also, Coursera, Udacity, OCW, Kahn and iTunes…

I've found that the smallest classes at my school have also been the most rewarding.

Sure you could sit in every day on my morning Thermo lecture and go unnoticed, but I've learned very little in that class that I couldn't already get out of an excellent textbook.

On the other hand Pharmacokinetics meets once a week in the professor's office. He also happens to be one of the leaders of the field. For two hours a week we get to discuss complex pharmacokinetic practices, ask open ended questions and, as he would say "learn how to learn". Museum Display Theory also meets once a week off campus with the head curator of the city art museum and today we discussed Foucault's Panopticon as it relates to museum curation.

These are things worth paying for, or as in my case, working hard enough to get financial aid for.

Re: A bachelor’s degree could cost $10,000 total. Here’s how

#26

Post by gph »

How I plan on getting a bachelor's degree for ~15k.

1. Go to a community college in a county that you are a resident for your two-year associates. The money I'm getting from Pell grants is paying my 18-credit hours per semester tuition right now (Roughly $120 per credit hour tuition). Books on top of that are costing me about 300 a semester (buy cheap old editions as much as possible). I've gotten scholarship money to cover that, and I'll also get Tax credit money.

2. Transfer to an in-state 4-year public university. Tuition rates will double for me during this transition, but YMMV (I'm in Maryland FYI). The hike in tuition will cost me about 7k a year for two years. Hence ~15k out of pocket for a degree.

Moral of the story: If you really want a premier education where you will be learning from those on the forefront of research, by all means spend 100k at an elite private college. If you want to be part of academia or research projects this is probably the route you have to take.

If instead you know what career you are going into and you have a desire to learn those skills on your own, then go the cheap route and just get the piece of paper to prove to HR you are worthy of a job.

*Obviously some careers might not fit this model, but I'd guess most people throwing money away at private universities could go this route with the same basic outcome.

Re: A bachelor’s degree could cost $10,000 total. Here’s how

#27

Post by mjburgess »

beagle3 wrote: post #12
aspensmonster wrote: post #7

How? Lower prices. Tuition+Fees used to hover around 10k total at public institutions.

The high prices are a symptom. The cause is cheap student loans: Since it is easy to get a loan, people will borrow as much as needed to get to the highest tier institution that will accept them. The private ones can thus increase their prices, and lure the staff with higher salaries. Now the public institutions need to level up salaries of professors and administrators, or they will leave for the private institution…

or just federally cap tuition fees

Re: A bachelor’s degree could cost $10,000 total. Here’s how

#28

Post by ballard »

L_Rahman wrote: post #25
ballard wrote: post #16

Or $0, if the sheepskin, corrected homework and grades won't matter. Audit classes at the large institution of your choice means just sitting in on whatever lectures you like. In big lecture halls, even with attendance, it's really quite simple to go unnoticed. Interactive classes JD/MBA might get dicey, but otherwise the worst that can happen is you get thrown out. BFD. Also, Coursera, Udacity, OCW, Kahn and iTunes…

I've found that the smallest classes at my school have also been the most rewarding. Sure you could sit in every day on my morning Thermo lecture and go unnoticed, but I've learned very little in that class that I couldn't already get out of an excellent textbook. On the other hand Pharmacokinetics meets once a week in the professor's office. He also happens to be one of the leaders of the field. For two hours a week…

For sure. Most people get ripped off on general electives at big brand schools.

Caltech has/had pretty awesome staff/student ratio.

Re: A bachelor’s degree could cost $10,000 total. Here’s how

#29

Post by jseliger »

OldSchool wrote: post #21

$10K Isn't too far off from what tuition for my EE degree cost in the late 80's. Even adjusted for real inflation it shouldn't be a penny more than $20K, possibly as low as about $15K today. That was of course at a state school. The somewhat counter-intuitive answer is that easy money has increased the price of education, in this case easy borrowing. The same phenomenon is responsible for almost all bubbles in modern…

The somewhat counter-intuitive answer is that easy money has increased the price of education, in this case easy borrowing.

Based on my reading of Archibald and Feldman's book Why Does College Cost So Much?, that doesn't seem to be the case: their data show that Baumol's Cost Disease is the real culprit.

Re: A bachelor’s degree could cost $10,000 total. Here’s how

#30

Post by gojomo »

Economist Garrett Jones has observed that by the signalling-theory of education, the race for ever-more-degrees is an individually-attractive but net-socially-destructive activity, almost like pollution… and generally you don't want to subsidize pollution:

http://econlog.econlib.org/archives/2012/09/degree_pollutio....

As a few of the comments there note, this could actually form an argument for taxing rather than subsidizing schooling.

I believe the reasoning can be refined (as my bottom-most comment there notes): actual education still has positive social externalities. It's the granting of prestigious, rationed credentials that leads to the negative-sum competition, institutional rents, and growing costs.

So maybe, we could subsidize education… but tax credentials. The unbundling of education and assessment, as is happening with online offerings and could be further encouraged by policy, could make this easier.

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