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Revealed: Qatar's World Cup 'slaves'

theguardian.com

101–110 of 147 posts

Re: Revealed: Qatar's World Cup 'slaves'

#101

I am appalled by the conditions but I don't think any of these articles is going to change a single thing in Qatar. I believe it will continue happening in Qatar. Only way to stop it is educate people from poorer countries to not go there no matter how enticing it seems(just like a mirage).

Once those people from poorer countries are educated and stop going there, they'll be replaced by people from an even poorer country.

In the early 80s, there were a lot of Korean workers in the Middle East. As the economy in Korea boomed and they had less of a reason to go the Middle East, they were replaced by Indians. As the Indian economy boomed in the 90s/00s, they were replaced by Nepalis, Bangladeshis and others.

Re: Revealed: Qatar's World Cup 'slaves'

#102

This is shocking... how? The arab empire was built on the slave trade. The whole of Dubai exists solely due to external workers, from engineers to the bricklayers. This should not shock anyone.

The only shocking thing is how we in the US put up with this behavior from governments we send billions in aid to every year. You'd think we'd have the balls to suspend some their aid and have them put an end to this type of abuse.

The US sends billions in aid to Qatar and Dubai? I think what you mean is that these countries buy billions of $ of US weapons every year.

Re: Revealed: Qatar's World Cup 'slaves'

#103
post #75
post #2

From the article: • Evidence of forced labour on a huge World Cup infrastructure project. • Some Nepalese men have alleged that they have not been paid for months and have had their salaries retained to stop them running away. • Some workers on other sites say employers routinely confiscate passports and refuse to issue ID cards, in effect reducing them to the status of illegal aliens. • Some labourers say they have…

I lived and worked in Qatar and none of this is new to me. These people are treated in horrible conditions and I don't think Qataris have a second thought about it. They genuinely believe they are superior people and are permitted to do this to those lower than them (I am generalizing, yes, there are some good people there, but this is the most pervasive mindset. Just look up horror stories of how Filipina maids are…

This is one of the biggest reasons I can't wait for alternative energy sources to become more prevalent. The Middle East will sink back into irrelevance.

Re: Revealed: Qatar's World Cup 'slaves'

#104
post #78

Terrible. This reminds me of what was going on in Saipan 20 years ago. A paradise of conservative/libertarian economic governance that Jack Abramoff and Tom Delay worked so hard to protect from the horrors of organized labor and worker's rights. http://www.nytimes.com/1993/07/18/world/made-usa-hard-labor-...

hold up. in no way is/was Saipan a paradise of libertarian economic governance. From your article: "If we complain, then our bosses would send us back to China and take away all of our money. Our families need the money." No libertarian I know, me included, would object to (rather, we would support) massive penalties for any entity that engaged in such behavior. Additionally, Jack Abramoff and Tom Delay are the exact…

I think the "paradise of libertarian economic governance" was sarcasm

Re: Revealed: Qatar's World Cup 'slaves'

#105
post #92
post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

American newspaper headlines often use quotes in this way too. And those are often mistaken for scare quotes as well.

(American) Usually when I see it intended as a quote in the headline, the "says X named official" is either in the headline or in the lede, which will basically just be an expansion of the headline anyway. Often though, that's not the case, and there's palpable sarcasm associated with the quote. (I've come to dislike that style of writing stories.)

I associate that style of writing more with magazines than newspapers, though I suppose I don't read a lot of physical newspapers these days and maybe there is a plague of sarcastic headlines on news articles that I'm just not aware of.

Re: Revealed: Qatar's World Cup 'slaves'

#106
post #33

As someone who lives in the Emirates, I have to object to the allegation of "slaves." This is not slavery. It's indentured servitude, which is definitely distressing but not quite of the same character. Most importantly, in the talks I've had with workers, the vast majority of them still are happy to have these jobs despite the conditions. They're paid an order of magnitude more than they make in Nepal and if you go…

Indentured servitude is debt bondage made explicitly so (contractually). When a worker says, "we were compelled to come just to make a living, but we've had no luck", that seems like they've been tricked into working as indentured servants without prior knowledge.

Not at all. Almost none of them have enough to pay their recruitment or travel fees, so they fully understand that for a time all their wages will go towards that.

I fail to see how retaining pay until a hiring debt is paid off isn't the very definition of indentured servitude.

Re: Revealed: Qatar's World Cup 'slaves'

#107

Qatar's 2022 World Cup is a major controversy even outside of this. FIFA accepts World Cup bids mainly on the basis of bribery, but Qatar was a bridge too far. The country is so unsuitable to host a World Cup while simultaneously being so full of money that's being spent chasing prestige that it's completely blatant what really happened there. The temperature is over 100 in the summer, so even with massive air condit…

Do the terms "winter" and "summer" in this context only refer to the northern hemisphere? Was Australia's "summer" bid to place the tournament in their winter? Presumably they have better weather in the winter.

Re: Revealed: Qatar's World Cup 'slaves'

#108
post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Indentured servitude is debt bondage made explicitly so (contractually). When a worker says, "we were compelled to come just to make a living, but we've had no luck", that seems like they've been tricked into working as indentured servants without prior knowledge.

I think pretty much all of them are well aware that the cost of flying them to the Gulf far exceeds their savings and they won't have the funds to fly back of their own accord before their contract is up. It's not one of these trafficking situations where they've been told they've been found a nice domestic service job in the capital and they subsequently end up in an underground brothel in another country. They have…

> It's not one of these trafficking situations where they've been told they've been found a nice domestic service job in the capital and they subsequently end up in an underground brothel in another country.

Exactly. Honestly, it's very telling that the vast majority of migrant workers in the gulf are men. They're doing hard manual labor, in admittedly poor conditions, but that is by and large what they signed up for.

> They have good reason to expect to have access to food and their post-deduction wages though.

Agreed. And that's why the instances where they don't even receive that are so alarming and do trigger government investigations.

Re: Revealed: Qatar's World Cup 'slaves'

#109
As somebody who spent a few years in Saudi Arabia (as well as visiting some of its fellow oil rich neighbors)...I can confirm this problem which is endemic to all rich Middle Eastern countries. As an American of Indian ethnicity (I can speak Hindi), I was able to see how people from these countries treat folks from the Indian subcontinent.

They're all basically nouveau-riche. They bring in what is slave labor/indentured servitude from poorer countries like Pakistan, India, Bangladesh, Nepal, the Philippines, etc. They clean the toilets, they serve the food at McDonalds, they build every house and skyscraper, the work the oil fields...in other words all the dirty jobs. Likewise people from western countries are brought into do the white collar work -- doctors, engineers, architects, etc....though they're having a blast.

I would say the situation is analogous to illegal immigrants from Mexico in the US -- but believe it or not we're way way way way way nicer to our illegal immigrants than these countries are to their legal immigrants! They live in terrible and barbaric conditions very similar to those described in the article. What makes it all so horrid is the disparity in wealth between the way they live and the way the elites live. If you're in Dubai, you can go snowboarding on a ski slope inside a shopping mall -- built by some guy who's in the outskirts of the city, sleeping in a hot tin can with 12 other guys, a broken AC, completely sore body, and sun burnt skin. You'll sometimes see Arab guys screaming at/assaulting these people at stores, shops, or taxis as if they're feudal lords talking to their peasants.

My father calls these immigrants heroes. They take shit (physically, verbally, mentally) you and I could not imagine just to send back the equivalent of $100-$200 a month to their families back home. That small amount of money enables them to educate their kids, feed their family, build homes, businesses, etc. They dream of the day they get to return home and finally see their families again.

Re: Revealed: Qatar's World Cup 'slaves'

#110

Qatar's 2022 World Cup is a major controversy even outside of this. FIFA accepts World Cup bids mainly on the basis of bribery, but Qatar was a bridge too far. The country is so unsuitable to host a World Cup while simultaneously being so full of money that's being spent chasing prestige that it's completely blatant what really happened there. The temperature is over 100 in the summer, so even with massive air condit…

I think this is new to many people and thus well worth reporting.

Also, homosexuality was decriminalised in Russia in 1993. The recent law bans distributing material about non-traditional sexual relations to minors. It does not make it illegal to be gay in Russia.

Contrast this to Qatar where it is illegal to be a male and homosexual - the punishment being a couple of years in prison and public lashing.

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