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In 2016, Paris to be home to the biggest startup incubator in the world

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Re: In 2016, Paris to be home to the biggest startup incubator in the world

#61

Post by swalsh »

I had this dream a few years ago, that it would fun to move somewhere other than the US, and start a business. I thought it was fun to experience a new culture, and maybe provide something useful. One of places I looked was France, because its the only other language i speak. The immigration laws seemed overwhelmingly difficult for someone like myself (I have a great engineering job in the US, but no degree).

In the end, I got married and bought a house. A different dream I suppose.

Re: In 2016, Paris to be home to the biggest startup incubator in the world

#62

Post by DanielBMarkham »

This might be a good time to point out the differences between startup incubators that work and those that work politically.

Political organizations do things to create political impact. In their terms, a successful startup incubator would have a big building, be designed by a great architect, have funding for hundreds of teams at a time, get funding in memorable ways, and have lots of press-worthy events. In short, whatever it takes to look good on television. Political organizations do things for political reasons.

From what little we know, actually effective incubators emphasize failure, exist in a culture of mutual support, are part of a larger technically-inclined ecosystem, nurture small teams, and exist as a really low-key, ongoing creative chaos of conversations and contacts. In short, little and somewhat trivial non-press worthy things that accumulate when added together. This is why things like difficulty to start a business, or hire/fire employees, get mentioned so often. It's not that any one thing is a deal-killer, it's that a few dozen pains in the ass will destroy all the myriad low level contributors you need for a good startup ecosystem to work. It all adds up.

My goal here isn't to criticize the effort, simply to point out the difference between things that are newsworthy and things that might actually make a difference. I wish these Paris guys the best of luck in the world. Here's hoping they can work through whatever obstacles they find.

Re: In 2016, Paris to be home to the biggest startup incubator in the world

#64

Post by sanityinc »

lhnz wrote: post #49

The perfect location for a startup would have: 1. Low cost of living. 2. Low house pricing/rent. (As rent-seeking forces people into being wage-slaves.) 3. Low regulation and bureaucracy. 4. Low taxes. 5. Educated, creative, and risk-taking workforce. 6. Ease of finance. I see so many countries trying to compete in the startup ecosystem by just trying to cargo-cult their way into it with a bit of investment and a bra…

In my personal experience, the UK ticks all these boxes, at least outside Greater London. Good state schooling and the NHS go a long way towards lowering the cost of living.

Re: In 2016, Paris to be home to the biggest startup incubator in the world

#65

Post by touristtam »

bsaul wrote: post #35
fab13n wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are many things to fix in France to encourage start-ups, indeed. And containing bureaucracy will be harder than tax issues IMO. However, what's very important in this endeavor this that it's 90% financed by Xavier Niel, a single private entrepreneur who's specialized in blowing up bureaucratic / oligopolistic businesses. He's pioneered minitel services (including sexual content, which got him some flak), then c…

same here. i was skeptical of Niel as well, but with 42 he really showed that he was honest with his intention to change the country's mentality. i also saw an interview of fleur pellerin the other day and she seems like a "hands in the dirt" person. that's a real change from previous ministers in her position. that's really the first time i'm optimistic about a state sponsored big project.

What is that 42.fr website like? I mean there are tones of useful resource online for wannabe developer. So I don't really get what this one has to be so special. Is it because it is all in French?

Re: In 2016, Paris to be home to the biggest startup incubator in the world

#66

Post by wes-exp »

lhnz wrote: post #58
untog wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What about the perfect location for startup employees? New York has an astronomically high cost of living, but it's not like people are somehow tricked into paying it. It also has world-class transportation, social scene, arts, etc. etc. If you want a "low cost of living", you're going to pay the price for it in another way. Your "educated, creative" workforce might not be all that inclined to stay.

That sounds correct, though there definitely has to be a location which is somewhere in between the two polar opposites. I find it hard to believe that Silicon Valley was always as expensive as it is now...

In the early days, leading up to the founding of Intel, one of Silicon Valley's main features was that it was dirt cheap. In fact it was dirt; it was farmland. This made it a reasonable base to set up chip manufacturing, which needed lots of workers at minimum cost.

Re: In 2016, Paris to be home to the biggest startup incubator in the world

#67

Post by ximeng »

hartator wrote: post #36

I have a business in both Austin, TX and Paris. I want to share my experience. France is doomed. Taxes and red tape are harder and harder every month. Just today, they have announced they want to raise a new tax on video games (wtf) and distribute the money to french video game large editor. (wtf) You can't do violent games or game that don't picture well the french culture. (wtf!) If you are an indie game developer…

Economist has an article this week on French people being unhappy with taxes that may be of interest.

http://www.economist.com/blogs/economist-explains/2013/09/ec...

Re: In 2016, Paris to be home to the biggest startup incubator in the world

#68

Post by hershel »

sassyalex wrote: post #13
VeejayRampay wrote: post #3

Let me be the classical Frenchy (i.e. never happy) here and point out that as long as the tax code, red tape and overall overwhelming paperwork entrepreneurs in France have to deal with won't be reduced or greatly simplified, having big incubators will be a nice touch but the road to growth will still be paved with unnecessary hurdles. The task at hand is HUGE, one that not so many developed countries have to deal wi…

In this startup incubator there will be a counter with administrative people to help us with all this paperwork. So less pain with all this formalities, we will just have to pay more as we are in France. By the way, one more time, thanks Xavier Niel, he's the only one in France who invests so much money on things like this and taking so many initiatives to make things change. He gave us the cheapest contract for mobi…

Cold you tell more about 42 school and it's innovative learning method ?

Re: In 2016, Paris to be home to the biggest startup incubator in the world

#69

Post by hartator »

maz-dev wrote: post #44
hartator wrote: post #36

I have a business in both Austin, TX and Paris. I want to share my experience. France is doomed. Taxes and red tape are harder and harder every month. Just today, they have announced they want to raise a new tax on video games (wtf) and distribute the money to french video game large editor. (wtf) You can't do violent games or game that don't picture well the french culture. (wtf!) If you are an indie game developer…

Regarding the taxes, deal with it. full disclosure: I'm french and I like the healthcare system. You can fire someone easily. You just have to provide a good reason for it. "Oh well, after all I shouldn't have hired him" or "This guys is not the best I could find, he doensn't give 120%" won't allow you to fire someone, no luck you're in France, labor code is sacred here. VAT is not painful at all, even an accountant…

> Regarding the taxes, deal with it. full disclosure: I'm french and I like the healthcare system.

Sure.. How long will it last?

> VAT is not painful at all, even an accountant fresh out from school could handle this easily. Protip, hire an accountant. If you're a business, VAT is transparent for you. It only impacts french customers.

It's a myth. Companies pay VAT, you pay 19,60% of the value added by your company.

> You don't have to declare every website to the government, you declare it to the CNIL which is an independent administrative body whose goal is to protect data privacy. I like them too.

They haven't stop PRISM. Nothing is independent, the CNIL gets its money from state taxes, it's government.

> Why setting up a business in France if you only see the drawbacks of being here?

I am from france.

> Though I agree with you on the bullshit part. This incubator is a total waste of money

We agree on something! :)

Re: In 2016, Paris to be home to the biggest startup incubator in the world

#70

Post by subsystem »

swalsh wrote: post #61

I had this dream a few years ago, that it would fun to move somewhere other than the US, and start a business. I thought it was fun to experience a new culture, and maybe provide something useful. One of places I looked was France, because its the only other language i speak. The immigration laws seemed overwhelmingly difficult for someone like myself (I have a great engineering job in the US, but no degree). In the…

It's pretty difficult to immigrate to most "attractive" places without a degree, the US included.
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