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Being poor changes your thinking about everything

washingtonpost.com

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Re: Being poor changes your thinking about everything

#181

Post by hosh »

discostrings wrote: post #172
hosh wrote: post #165

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Responsibility is usually a concept that is emotionally tied with blame and punishment. That's how most people talk about responsibility. However, if you are reacting to past associations with rewards and punishments, you are not being response-able. Being responsible doesn't mean, "I am going to be a responsible adult," as in, "I am fulfilling this socially-conditioned image of an 'adult'." Responsibility means bein…

Yes, the common notion of "responsibility" you criticize is what I was responding to and talking about: the rule-based, considered-in-advance, "responsible choice" idea that having children in certain situations is "irresponsible". You are saying that that definition isn't really responsibility at all, and while I'd have to think about it some more to be sure, I think I agree. Many people use the term in the prescrip…

By the way, it was in my teenage years that I first encountered the idea of respond-ability. This was first introduced implicitly by reading nearly all of Robert A. Heinlein's novels. I think I came across the formal concept in Steven Covey's Seven Habits of Highly Effective People.

However, it wasn't until in the past couple years that I understood "acceptance" (and that understanding is not acceptance). That required practicing a specific form of mindfulness meditation, called Vipassana, or insight meditation. All of Vipassana is simply accepting the sensations, emotions, and thoughts as they arise ... and pass. Usually, there are comfortable and comforting sensations, emotions, and thoughts that we don't want to let go of, and ugly stuff we don't want to experience. Acceptance is acceptance, whether stuff comes up or passes on. Usually, people's fundamental, existential misery kicks in and they run away from Vipassana. Your mileage may vary.

Re: Being poor changes your thinking about everything

#182

Post by PeterisP »

tsotha wrote: post #176
PeterisP wrote: post #146

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why do you equate lack of population growth with a bad future? USA was a perfectly fine country back in 1990 when it had 250m people; and it would be a perfectly fine country if it'd have 250m people today instead of the current 315m. In fact (contrary to "nothing that increases happiness half as much as having a child") I'd say that the Earth might be a happier place if the future had, say, 1-2 billion people instea…

>Why do you equate lack of population growth with a bad future? When the health of your social programs is based on continued population growth the future may indeed be grim without it.

Actually, the health of our social programs isn't that based on continued population growth; they'd work pretty much the same with a stable population size.

However, the bane of those social programs is quickly increasing lifespans. No matter if population growth is zero or huge, if you're currently below 45, you anyway have to "prepare for yourself" rather than expect them to survive in the current form - unless the retirement age moves beyond 80 within this decade.

Re: Being poor changes your thinking about everything

#183

Post by [deleted] »

wolfgke wrote: post #13
teddyh wrote: post #2

I'm very much reminded of these: http://www.cracked.com/blog/5-things-nobody-tells-you-about-... http://www.cracked.com/blog/the-5-stupidest-habits-you-devel... http://www.cracked.com/blog/4-things-politicians-will-never-... Especially the last one. EDIT: Fixed last link

Having read these articles, there's one thing that I don't appreciate: in these articles kids of poor people are mentioned. Why in the hell are these people "producing" children, if they aren't 100% certain that they'll be able to support them for the years until they are old enough to stand on their own feet? Strokes of fate that lead to poverty are one side, but the side is reproding if you are poor: I consider thi…

[deleted]

Re: Being poor changes your thinking about everything

#184

Post by afterburner »

tsotha wrote: post #180
afterburner wrote: post #177

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My position that the rich (and their corporations) have more influence on law-making than the poor, and that this can disadvantage the poor? I think it's hilarious you find this controversial; it has been the case throughout human history in all systems of government. Pretending this doesn't happen really doesn't help except in order to encourage complacency on the part of the poor. I still don't think you understand…

>My position that the rich (and their corporations) have more influence on law-making than the poor, and that this can disadvantage the poor? Is that a question? Of course wealthy people have more influence, and that's a good thing, too. If they didn't the poor people would vote themselves everyone else's money and complain when the economy crashed. But I don't think the laws "screw" the poor. Whenever the government…

"Is that a question?"

Let's take a look at the original quote from you I was responding to:

"Is it the poor who have power to change things, or the rich?"

Yeah, that was the question.

Re: Being poor changes your thinking about everything

#185

Post by guspe »

Most of the comments here focus on poverty but the author is talking about a broader subject, he is talking about scarcity. Being poor is but one of the forms to experience scarcity. And this is a brilliant idea.

What intrigues me is that poverty is essential to the dynamics of capitalism. Some are rich because some are poor. Modern capitalism operates on a very abstract layer and my basic comprehension of economics is not enough to understand how this relationship between rich and poor translates to modern times but I have I feeling it still holds true.

That said, and here's an inconvenient idea, what if some are lonely because others have too many friends? In the same way the richness of some breeds the poverty of others, what if the abundance of some breeds the scarcity of others? I hope you understand this doesn't imply guilty on any side. It just hints at a somewhat cruel dynamics underlying the commodification of life. Doesn't it?

Re: Being poor changes your thinking about everything

#186

Post by fckthensa2 »

wolfgke wrote: post #13
teddyh wrote: post #2

I'm very much reminded of these: http://www.cracked.com/blog/5-things-nobody-tells-you-about-... http://www.cracked.com/blog/the-5-stupidest-habits-you-devel... http://www.cracked.com/blog/4-things-politicians-will-never-... Especially the last one. EDIT: Fixed last link

Having read these articles, there's one thing that I don't appreciate: in these articles kids of poor people are mentioned. Why in the hell are these people "producing" children, if they aren't 100% certain that they'll be able to support them for the years until they are old enough to stand on their own feet? Strokes of fate that lead to poverty are one side, but the side is reproding if you are poor: I consider thi…

Poor people are "producing" children because they actually want to have children and love them just like anyone else. Not having children will be seen as just another inequality imposed on them.

Re: Being poor changes your thinking about everything

#187

Post by lutusp »

fckthensa2 wrote: post #186
wolfgke wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Having read these articles, there's one thing that I don't appreciate: in these articles kids of poor people are mentioned. Why in the hell are these people "producing" children, if they aren't 100% certain that they'll be able to support them for the years until they are old enough to stand on their own feet? Strokes of fate that lead to poverty are one side, but the side is reproding if you are poor: I consider thi…

Poor people are "producing" children because they actually want to have children and love them just like anyone else. Not having children will be seen as just another inequality imposed on them.

There's some truth to that, but it's also true that children are an economic factor in the lives of the poor, especially those involved in agriculture.

Re: Being poor changes your thinking about everything

#188

Post by pnathan »

javert wrote: post #131
pnathan wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's pretty true too. That's more or less how my graduate work worked. I finished, but it was rough at times,

For a _master's_ degree? Or have you gotten a PhD and neglected to update your profile? :P

Yup, for my Master's. :-)

Re: Being poor changes your thinking about everything

#189

Post by tsotha »

afterburner wrote: post #184
tsotha wrote: post #180

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>My position that the rich (and their corporations) have more influence on law-making than the poor, and that this can disadvantage the poor? Is that a question? Of course wealthy people have more influence, and that's a good thing, too. If they didn't the poor people would vote themselves everyone else's money and complain when the economy crashed. But I don't think the laws "screw" the poor. Whenever the government…

"Is that a question?" Let's take a look at the original quote from you I was responding to: "Is it the poor who have power to change things, or the rich?" Yeah, that was the question.

That's not what I was responding to.

Re: Being poor changes your thinking about everything

#190

Post by javert »

pnathan wrote: post #188
javert wrote: post #131

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For a _master's_ degree? Or have you gotten a PhD and neglected to update your profile? :P

Yup, for my Master's. :-)

Wow, that sounds very atypical for a master's degree and, frankly, not entirely fair.
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