>The flaw is in the assumption that every STEM degree holder is a qualified candidate for a STEM job.
There is also a flaw in the assumption that every STEM jobholder is qualified for a STEM job.
Is there a STEM worker shortage?
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Re: Is there a STEM worker shortage?
#12This is a view I've held for a while... that the shortage isn't with people holding square pieces of paper with fancy latin on it proclaiming competence. Rather the shortage is a talent shortage and degrees are a very poor indicator of talent.
There was another article on HN a while ago and it stated that only about half of STEM workers have a STEM degree. Meanwhile, 75% of STEM degree holders didn't have a STEM job. Maybe the problem lies with the process of getting a degree?
Re: Is there a STEM worker shortage?
#13It's a concerning trend. Lot's of people go into the fields looking for high salaries and job opportunities, and then have no interest and thus talent in the field. There's so many totally inept people with even graduate degrees in computer science.
At the same time, look into some of the top University's CS exams and they're writing code on paper. They're not training effective and talented programmers, they're training effective exam writers.
Re: Is there a STEM worker shortage?
#14tl;dr: there is no shortage, its just that most candidates are crap
And the real reason that the "candidates are crap" is that too many employers no longer spend the time and resources to train their workers properly. Instead employees are expected to get hired with insanely specific skills and "hit the ground running" working for some clueless line and project managers who don't give a damn about what happens outside of their small-minded metrics.
One more reason to work as a consultant/freelancer or for a small business (startups included). In these settings you have a lot of control over the tech stack and can optimize your skills for the changing market. You can also devote whatever reasonable amount of time you need to learning new things as you go. In most of these environments, polyglots are rewarded and encouraged, which means much less career risk, since you can hit the ground running on a wider array of projects.
Re: Is there a STEM worker shortage?
#15Earlier quoted context omitted.
Exactly. I've interviewed recent UC Berkeley EECS [1] graduates and found they couldn't write a line of code, and Berkeley is a top 10 engineering and top 10 computer science school (or at least was a the time; haven't checked rankings recently). [1] Electrical Engineering and Computer Science; their B.S. degree in computer science. I think they have a B.A. as well.
Come on... do you _REALLY_ mean they can't write a line of code? I find that hard to believe.
I believe it. Sadly, cheating has become endemic in STEM degree programs.
Re: Is there a STEM worker shortage?
#16We discuss this every other day on here, do other professions, I'm just curious.
Re: Is there a STEM worker shortage?
#17>The flaw is in the assumption that every STEM degree holder is a qualified candidate for a STEM job. There is also a flaw in the assumption that every STEM jobholder is qualified for a STEM job.
IDK, I could see this the other way around too. If you are currently doing the job, then you must be qualified for it, or are soon to be fired. There are probably some small percentage of people who just slide under the radar, but I would think if you were entirely incompetent and unable to do your job you would not last long.
Re: Is there a STEM worker shortage?
#18This sounds to me like the issue is more university programs: people completing a STEM degree SHOULD come out of it able to take on a STEM job.
From the hiring side, I agree with the dearth of quality candidates, and on the job training is often the current solution.
From my own university experience: the wrong things were being taught, and depth was pretty much out of the question. I can only imagine its worse elsewhere.
Only due to my personal side projects did I end up getting the knowledge needed for a job.
Re: Is there a STEM worker shortage?
#19Is it possible that industry automation reduces the workers needed for some positions, freeing them to look for other positions, thus increasing the pool of candidates? That would go some way towards explaining why projected STEM job candidate numbers are always below reality.
Automation affects many jobs. Just because a job isn't replaced entirely by a robot or program, doesn't mean it hasn't been rendered significantly easier or less time consuming, reducing the personnel required.
CAD is probably one of the oldest examples of this. What's to say that similar changes aren't taking place in many industries now?
Re: Is there a STEM worker shortage?
#20No.